TD not paying vendor

[Birdie30]

Has anyone ever ran into this? If so what did you do about it, did you get paid?

I recently vended a large tournament for a local TD that is refusing to pay me for my services. Won't answer phone calls or text messages. I sent an invoice for vending with no response. Pretty ****ty right? So I contacted the pdga thinking they would handle the situation, right? I mean what do we pay them for? To my surprise they won't or can't do anything they say. They only are responsible for TD reports and player payouts. They won't even remove his TD status. I find this pretty shady and would like others opinions and help for my situation.
Let me know what you think.

 

[Jay Dub]

I'm naive about this and why I ask....what do they pay you for? Are you selling their discs?

 

[tbird888]

Do you have a contract? How is it that you're being paid as a vendor? I thought most vendors paid for the right to shill their wares, not the other way around.

 

[JC17393]

Shady as **** but what exactly do you expect the PDGA to do about it? They're not small claims court. There are no PDGA rules requiring TDs to pay their vendors (common decency and the law should cover that). Not sure what they could even do...suspending the TD doesn't get you any restitution.

You want to get outside authorities involved, your best bet is probably small claims court. Sue the guy and get the courts to compel him to pay up.

Or, put him on blast and out the guy publicly. Maybe if locals know the guy is stiffing you, they can help lean on him until he makes it right. Or stop supporting his events.

 

[JC17393]

I'm assuming by "vending" he means supplying the prizes or player packs for the ams? If the ams cashed in their payouts with this guy and he never got paid for that merch, the TD is a dink.

 

[brutalbrutus]

^JC with the snipage...

He probably agreed to do the payout merch. Then the TD stiffed him on the registration fees that are used to cover that.

 

[Birdie30]

Yes, I agreed to do the payout merch for the am payouts. Which I have not been paid for from the td.

Unfortunately I do not have a contract. I have been doing this for years now without ever having to have one and never been a problem. Definitely going to have to have one from now on! Which is sad to think. It blows my mind someone would even consider doing this.

Does anyone else think this should be something the pdga should consider changing and adding to their rules to protect vendors? Its not right that the pdga wont even take away his td rights. Basically their allowing a criminal to continue to be a criminal?

Has anyone one gone through small claims court? Have any insight for me?

 

[Stable]

Does anyone else think this should be something the pdga should consider changing and adding to their rules to protect vendors?

I've always thought that the PDGA should remove the players pack requirement. It always bothered me that I (as an 'am') had to basically purchase items that I didn't want or need in order to participate in a PDGA event.

That said, did you have any kind of conversation with this TD before the tournament? Did this TD think you were 'gifting' all that gear?

 

[JC17393]

The PDGA is a player organization. Unless the players at the tournament got shorted, their jurisdiction is nil. Their rules don't cover vendors nor should they. Vendors aren't necessary to run a tournament.

You want to do damage to the TD, name him publicly.

 

[Old Dog]

I'm assuming by "vending" he means supplying the prizes or player packs for the ams? If the ams cashed in their payouts with this guy and he never got paid for that merch, the TD is a dink.

Sucks for sure. Without a signed contract you are probably SOL when it comes to Small Claims Court.
You may just have to chock this up as a learning experience and your losses as the cost of tuition. :\

 

[Jay Dub]

The best way to get your money, if at all, is do like JC said. Gather all your contact with him, emails, PMs, etc, and post them on social media.
Facebook has a feedback page just for things like this but you'll have to have proof it happened.

https://www.facebook.com/groups/DGfeedback/

 

[joecoin]

Sucks for sure. Without a signed contract you are probably SOL when it comes to Small Claims Court.
You may just have to chock this up as a learning experience and your losses as the cost of tuition. :\

Nonsense. If you take him to court and he admits to not paying, or you have rock solid proof, you should be awarded a judgment.

Now, collecting on a judgment is another matter, If he has a real job you can garnish his wages.

 

[SonicGuy]

Sucks for sure. Without a signed contract you are probably SOL when it comes to Small Claims Court.
You may just have to chock this up as a learning experience and your losses as the cost of tuition. :\

Nonsense. If you take him to court and he admits to not paying, or you have rock solid proof, you should be awarded a judgment.

Now, collecting on a judgment is another matter, If he has a real job you can garnish his wages.

+1 for joecoin. A written contract is not required in this instance. You will get your judgement. And good luck collecting lol.

 

[DavidSauls]

Does anyone else think this should be something the pdga should consider changing and adding to their rules to protect vendors? Its not right that the pdga wont even take away his td rights. Basically their allowing a criminal to continue to be a criminal?

No.

The PDGA shouldn't get involved in all of the transactions by all of the TDs. That's thousands of events, and negotiations with merch vendors, food vendors, course owners, government agencies, and others. In no way does the PDGA have the resources to govern that.

Of all the things the PDGA does, and things I wish they do, this would be way down the list....if on the list, at all.

We have laws to deal with criminals.

 

[brutalbrutus]

No.

The PDGA shouldn't get involved in all of the transactions by all of the TDs. That's thousands of events, and negotiations with merch vendors, food vendors, course owners, government agencies, and others. In no way does the PDGA have the resources to govern that.

Of all the things the PDGA does, and things I wish they do, this would be way down the list....if on the list, at all.

We have laws to deal with criminals.

..and what if said TDs were found liable for this crime. The PDGA should just continue to allow them to be TDs and do it again? The TD is the front line of the PDGA, I would think they should want them to deal honestly with their vendors, even require them to... If they get away with this, what's to stop them from trying to stiff players the next time? Or the PDGA themselves get stiffed for their sanctioning fees?

 

[DavidSauls]

At least that would mean someone else using considerable resources to investigate, interrogate, hold a trial, etc.

Or should we require criminal background checks on all TDs (there's a huge chunk of money)?

And what crimes will we deny sanctioning for?

The scale of adjudicating disagreements between TDs and outside parties is greater than the PDGA can govern.

 

[JC17393]

..and what if said TDs were found liable for this crime. The PDGA should just continue to allow them to be TDs and do it again? The TD is the front line of the PDGA, I would think they should want them to deal honestly with their vendors, even require them to... If they get away with this, what's to stop them from trying to stiff players the next time? Or the PDGA themselves get stiffed for their sanctioning fees?

If a TD is found liable for this crime, what vendor is going to work for him? What players are going to support his events? I don't think any action would be required on the PDGA's part to prevent him from running events. No one would trust him anyway. That's why the TD needs to be named rather than spoken of in hypothetical terms.

As for stiffing the players or the PDGA, that's something for which they will act. Like I said before, they're a player organization. If you rip off the players or the organization, they have the authority to go after you. The sanctioning agreement is a contract. One with proscribed consequences for breaking it. You can't run a PDGA event without the PDGA or the players. You can run one without vendors. No reason for the PDGA to be involved in those transactions.

 

[joecoin]

PDGA has no Code of Conduct that TD's are required to adhere to?

 

[brutalbrutus]

Yea screw it. Just let TDs do whatever the hell they want to. The PDGA isn't big enough that PR is an issue anyway. :|

 

[jasonandsharon]

No.

The PDGA shouldn't get involved in all of the transactions by all of the TDs. That's thousands of events, and negotiations with merch vendors, food vendors, course owners, government agencies, and others. In no way does the PDGA have the resources to govern that.

Of all the things the PDGA does, and things I wish they do, this would be way down the list....if on the list, at all.

We have laws to deal with criminals.

The fact of the matter, from a legal standpoint, the PDGA IS probably also responsible for the TD if it was a sanctioned event. "Little League" has been sued by vendors of small-town events and lost. Although in both cases the organizations could claim "injured party" and also sue the TD. From what I have seen from the PDGA it seems to be very lacking in legal standards on sanctioning. There are very little contractual bindings involved in running a sanctioned event. Despite its size and sheer volume of events, the PDGA runs they still operate like a mom and pop company and its surprising they haven't been hit by lawsuits before.
As JC17393 said though this a for a court to decide and laws very from state to state.