The Inevitable 2017 Pros Switching Sponsors Thread

[Aim For The Chains]

They started a competing company. Bad mouth or not, they're taking food out of Innova's mouth. I know you understand that.

The biggest problem in DG is the major producers are not hurting for "food" but the industry is. The musical chairs of "pros" wont really ever end it just gives Innova-esq brands some edge. Bottom line is regardless of who sponsors who these contracts likely are all about the makers vs players. Prodigy became a maker b4 they had a real mover and shaker... Just tried to buy everyone in which doesnt work either..

 

[tbird888]

All of that is personal bias. Do better, Lyle.

Innova's in a very unique position in that they created the genre. They can rely on the "that's just a copy of our mold" all they want, but if it's truly a copy, why go to Innova if you prefer *insert competing company's mold* in what you feel is a better plastic? There are a ton of fantastic molds on the market today, but, as a cycler, are they still as good as the honeymoon ends? Even though Innova's molds season better than all their competitors (my opinion), does the pro really care? They get free plastic so when a mold "goes south", they replace as needed, for "free". As a consumer, the way a Roc flies after the flashing's gone away keeps me buying their products. Do I think I'm smarter than every disc golfer out there? Not by a long shot. Do I think a lot of people look at how a mold flies only when it's new, absolutely. Those "fools" are welcome to buy another disc.

 

[tbird888]

True, but that doesn't answer the direct animosity that seems palpable. Has to be that Innova feels betrayed or the three did it in a "sneaky" fashion. There doesn't seem to the same dynamic with Triology or even their arch nemesis, Discraft.

When someone who "works for you" starts a new company directly competing against you, you'd be a fool not to make an example of them. It's the nature of business. Innova's beveled edge patent is expired. Why not attack the companies that opened that didn't learn the game from you?*


*even though they're the one that is the biggest threat to your financial future...

 

[Aim For The Chains]

Only thing id disagree with is the molds "season" better. They just come in 5 different flavors of the same mold and even within same plastic sometimes which makes life easier vs other makers. Really comes down to volume which no other brand can compete.

 

[tbird888]

Only thing id disagree with is the molds "season" better. They just come in 5 different flavors of the same mold and even within same plastic sometimes which makes life easier vs other makers. Really comes down to volume which no other brand can compete.

As good as a fresh Roc is, it's 10X better when it's beat to death (as well as the spots along the way). Can you really say the same about any of the Roc clones on the market?

 

[SD86]

As good as a fresh Roc is, it's 10X better when it's beat to death (as well as the spots along the way). Can you really say the same about any of the Roc clones on the market?

Dunno about Roc clones specifically, but many Trilogy discs in Gold Line/Fuzion season in to awesomeness.

As to Prodigy, I like their plastics and I like their discs up to the F3 anf F5, but above that, Prodigy's goodness drops off severely. And like someone (don't remember who) said: Prodigy has good discs, but for every one of them someone else makes a little better one...

 

[GoldeyeGolf]

Dunno about Roc clones specifically, but many Trilogy discs in Gold Line/Fuzion season in to awesomeness.

As to Prodigy, I like their plastics and I like their discs up to the F3 anf F5, but above that, Prodigy's goodness drops off severely. And like someone (don't remember who) said: Prodigy has good discs, but for every one of them someone else makes a little better one...

That's just such a totally meaningless statement. Who is it that decides what's "better".

 

[SD86]

That's just such a totally meaningless statement. Who is it that decides what's "better".

The person that made that statement. It wasn't meaningless to him. And I pretty much agree with it. YMMV, which makes for horse racing and elections....

 

[GoldeyeGolf]

So 2 people believe that. OK, you convinced me.

 

[Herculé]

400s D1 seasons just perfectly.

 

[AndyJB]

Prodigy has some of the best plastic blends out there...of course that is totally subjective and only my opinion. I really liked the original M1 and M3 but I just never clicked with their discs.

To me (and here's where this gets relevant to the thread) Ive sort of always felt that Prodigy was geared towards pro-level disc golfers; at least advanced and up. I think there's nothing wrong with that and it's a great niche. None of us will probably ever know what went wrong with Paige, and Nikko is Nikko, but if I were Prodigy I'd be trying real hard to hang on to the pros like Grim Death. Ricky leaving and pretty promptly thereafter winning a world title with Lat64 doesnt bode well for them to those of us who follow such things.

I could be making mountains out of molehills though. I see Prodigy from time to time around here...seems like everyone that throws them has one or two Prodigy molds they love but then bag no others. Especially mids and lower.

I would like to hear, if Big Jerm leaves, why he made the move. He seems happier than ever and is playing really well with their discs. If it's just money I absolutley cannot blame him for that and commend him for knowing his own worth. If it's something else or a combination of different factors, I'd still love to know the juicy gossipy details,though it's of course none of my business.

 

[lyleoross]

As good as a fresh Roc is, it's 10X better when it's beat to death (as well as the spots along the way). Can you really say the same about any of the Roc clones on the market?

Interesting enough, I've never thrown a roc. Would never argue about the disc, given its long term popularity.

Most of my questions here aren't meant to take a position. Some business dynamics truly amaze me. As an outsider looking in and watching companies inflicting all to real self damage, I wonder at the human motivations. I'm not saying anyone is doing that, or not, just curious about motivations, rationale, and possible thinking.

By my measure Innova moves to pick up players with certain characteristics. It's part of their company imagery and presentation. They work pretty solidly to do that and I think it pays for them (of course that's my thinking and possibly dead wrong). Prodigy seemed to take the same approach and clearly, it hasn't gone as well.

As a strategy I suspect it works, but I'm more interested in the dynamics of Innova's approach and how far they go in their pursuit of a player. Is it strictly their size and consequent reputation, or is there more? And of course that pertains to this thread.

 

[SD86]

Prodigy has some of the best plastic blends out there...of course that is totally subjective and only my opinion. I really liked the original M1 and M3 but I just never clicked with their discs.

To me (and here's where this gets relevant to the thread) Ive sort of always felt that Prodigy was geared towards pro-level disc golfers; at least advanced and up. I think there's nothing wrong with that and it's a great niche. None of us will probably ever know what went wrong with Paige, and Nikko is Nikko, but if I were Prodigy I'd be trying real hard to hang on to the pros like Grim Death. Ricky leaving and pretty promptly thereafter winning a world title with Lat64 doesnt bode well for them to those of us who follow such things.

I could be making mountains out of molehills though. I see Prodigy from time to time around here...seems like everyone that throws them has one or two Prodigy molds they love but then bag no others. Especially mids and lower.

I would like to hear, if Big Jerm leaves, why he made the move. He seems happier than ever and is playing really well with their discs. If it's just money I absolutley cannot blame him for that and commend him for knowing his own worth. If it's something else or a combination of different factors, I'd still love to know the juicy gossipy details,though it's of course none of my business.

Excellent post, especially the first couple of paragraphs.
:clap: :clap: :clap:

 

[Flick Maniac]

I would like to hear, if Big Jerm leaves, why he made the move. He seems happier than ever and is playing really well with their discs.

This part. Is there a Big Jerm in the bag? What discs is he playing really well with especially (except obviously the stable distance drivers)?

Apologies in advance if someone takes this the wrong way and sucks a pea up their nose. Really, I am just curious.

 

[Streets]

As good as a fresh Roc is, it's 10X better when it's beat to death (as well as the spots along the way). Can you really say the same about any of the Roc clones on the market?

Truth. thread/

Edit: Oh, and Prodigy sux.

 

[DinosaurThunder]

Castro to Innova is the most surprising Pro sponsorship change for me personally this year. More so than the "big" names yet to come.

Very interesting.. this one flew under the radar for sure. For someone who prides himself on "liking" everything on social media, he has been quiet on this move.

 

[snappyj]

As good as a fresh Roc is, it's 10X better when it's beat to death (as well as the spots along the way). Can you really say the same about any of the Roc clones on the market?

The Zero Hard Mace was a disappointment, but I think a Ghost is a good enough clone to be great when beat to death, as well as spots along the way.

 

[tbird888]

I would definitely say that it has the most potential, but it just doesn't start out as wonderfully beefy as a good Roc does. Well, my Metallic thrower started out close, but I definitely prefer the plastic of a good matte KC.

 

[cjman]

This part. Is there a Big Jerm in the bag? What discs is he playing really well with especially (except obviously the stable distance drivers)?

Apologies in advance if someone takes this the wrong way and sucks a pea up their nose. Really, I am just curious.

He has recently released an ITB.

Jerm doesn't seem to use ...

1. Many discs. Watch his footage, he finds a disc that is performing well and goes with it. He seems to work a disc, instead of using x disc for x shot, and y for y.
2. Wildly OS discs. Get to his clinics or footage and you'll see he's not a OS power player - by choice. He'll have that beautiful, smooth FH for years.

 

[Dana]

Side note: Jerm slayed an A-tier in FL this weekend, won by 15. http://www.pdga.com/tour/event/25061