I've been awed many times in here by people noticing things I can't see in twenty repetitions. Now it's not that difficult any more but I still like to focus on several things separately because I've noticed that I can't follow everything simultaneously especially with pro level speeds in throws. With experience things become easier to notice. I've spent days looking at videos at full speed, slowed down and frame by frame. I actually saw the disc fly anhyzer so this time it wasn't as Sherlock Holmes as Blake
Pointing the toes and where the right plants in relation to your left leg and the direction you're x stepping towards are different things. Both have major effects on accuracy and timing is crucial.
Pointing the toes of the right foot should be easiest for accuracy to be left constantly in the best angle for power generation where you still can pivot to face the target when the disc leaves your hand. It's a very personal thing to find out the angle that works best for you and with practice that angle can change. If your timing is very dependent on the angle of the foot changing the angle may give you a hard time in adjusting and missing left or right consistently could be an issues for some time. In my case quite some time.
Toes pointing to 90 degrees left of the target at the plant requires a lot of energy(momentum and a hard push with the left leg) to let you pivot towards the target with your current timing and earlyish starting of the quick acceleration of the arm pull. And even then in slippery conditions it's entirely possible that you won't pivot around the right foot enough to face the target but have your chest and hips to the left of the target and the momentum carries you to step fast beyond your right leg with your left leg. Missing left with the disc unless you can compensate the aiming with the arm and that is very difficult. So is aborting the throw once (if you have the time to) you notice that you're not gonna pivot enough. Toes pointing 60 degrees left of the target allow for easier pivoting regardless of ground conditions to allow for more consistently facing the target at the expense of lost power. If you can learn two toe pointing directions (and timings that change with the angle changes) that goes a long way for all weather play. The less you point the toes away from the target the faster you'll face the target and the quicker you need to move the arm from reach back to release. That may change the speed/spin rate of the disc. There's a very good chance that shallower angles increase arm speed requirements and generate less spin. That is related to tendon bounce or plyometric loading. And is a large and different topic cover in many places and at detail elsewhere. Search function is your friend
What I was commenting on your video is where the right leg touches the ground in sideways position relative to your left leg and where you were x stepping to. If you step along the tee towards the target in the middle line of the tee for anhyzer your right leg should plant closer to the left side of the tee. For straight throws in the middle of the tee and for a hyzer to the right side of the tee.
That picture of Feldy is at the reach back. I used the term release to mean the time when the disc leaves the hand. I think that with approach throws your eyes should never leave the target for greatly increased accuracy vs turning away from the target. Generally for approach throws you should be able to reach the basket without turning away from the basket. If you can't reach the basket with a mid without turning your eyes from the basket that sounds like a two drive hole. until you get more D from drives and approaches. Or you're expecting too low a score on that hole compared to your capabilities. That often leads to throwing one or more strokes more than your skill suggests by taking too risky shots.
With speed I meant your power generation and the quickness of different body parts in motion. It doesn't take that long for your throw to happen in time.
Timing of the power usage in the arm pull is in part the order of event like you wrote and there's more about that in the articles on the main page. Another part is the timing of the quickest possible acceleration. I have a hunch based on physics, own training and watching some top guns of distance throwing that the often suggested advice about accelerating the arm full tilt as the rear of the disc passes the right pectoral muscle is a bit early timing. At that point you probably should start to accelerate the arm compared to the speed up to that point. But maybe not at full rate of acceleration yet. I'd think of a very mild accelration. A gradual acceleration may help to keep the position of the wrist down and other positions in correct orientations as well. Bary Schultz advocates this and what I'm suggesting might be called herky jrky in the last 8" of the arm stroke.
The term used on this board is elbow chop for the quick accceleration in the end of the throw. Climo clinics on youtube and Chris Voigt on The European Open 2006 DVD seem to chop the fastest during the last 8 or so inches of the throw. Voigt throws almost 700'. He may know something. If I understand correctly what's happening is another matter
What I'm thinking of is a bit of Schultz and the majority of Climo and Voigt. Considering my nose down success Barry has probably a more usable advice for people with less muscle power like me to keep the disc in the right orientation and Climo and Voigt are power houses. Big time and they have the experience and the muscle power to get away with late acceleration. Blake has put forward some calculations based on physics at the PDGA board in the hyper spin thread IIRC. That late acceleration is ideal in theory but how many can pull it off with proper form? And how much more muscle power do I and the other average Joes need to get to utilize this with drivers? That's why I'm so much more successful with mids that aren't as nose angle sensitive and the added spin keeps mids from turning over and fading less.
tspb said:
JR said:
Welcome!
Were you planning to throw anhyzer? Your plant step, that is the last step before the disc leaves your hand, lands to the left of the line you were moving towards and where the target lies. That produces anhyzer or clockwise tilt of the disc as it leaves your hand. Moving the right leg right leads to level or hyzer throws depending on how much you move the leg.
Its great to be here. I have been lurking for a few months reading all of the tips and I figured I would sign up and post.
Its amazing that you noticed the anhyzer without actually seeing where the disc went. I am really just trying to throw straight. This disc was a 169 TeeRex and it almost turned over on me. I didn't really understand why that was happening "randomly". I will try to focus on my plant foot being on my line next time i practice. (in 20 mins) Or i guess When i want to throw an Anhyzer or Hyzer I will adjust accordingly. Great tip!
So to confirm... If you throw straight but are pointing your feet left the disc goes right... and if you throw with an open stance pointing right the disc will go left. AMAZING. haha. I feel like a rookie.
JR said:
You're too upright when the disc leaves your hand. You do lean forward at the waist but too little and too late. That means that you're throwing the disc up. That makes having the front of the disc being lower than the rear of the disc very hard. The benefit to this is that the disc won't fade so much or at all and retains speed better for a lot longer distance. Heart over the right knee is usually helpful position when the disc leaves your hand.
http://www.discgolfreview.com/resources/images/dfeldberg3-3.jpg
This is more of the body position i want at release. Is this the same for Driving and shorter shots? Or can you get away with being upright for a 50% effort approach?
JR said:
I like your speed. You don't seem to start your arm pull at full power which is great but you'd benefit even more by waiting a little longer for the hard acceleration.
Do you mean the first half of the throw could be quite slow and then as you come through your body... *SNAP* with full power? I read here that the disc and arm should be the last thing to move before the throw... IE. feet, hips shoulders. Is this what you are also refering to?
Thanks so much
Rob
