30 second clock

[The Hammer]

From the conversation, though, what it seems is that 30 seconds is not enough time (unless you have a straightforward lie). We are relying on the good will of men, or some hippy crap like that, to only call when the thrower is abusing it (not when it gains them a stroke to call). It seems pretty naive to me.

It seems that you're the only one that has a problem with the rule as is.

 

[JC17393]

Going back to your original question, no, the clock never resets because you need to change discs. The only time it would reset is if there was a distraction in the area that makes you take pause. Wind is not a distraction.

30 seconds is plenty of time to select a disc, change your mind and grab a different disc, change your mind once more and then throw.

I'd argue that there's no such thing at all as the clock resetting. I can't recall if this is something that used to be in the rule or just something that's always been assumed to be allowed, but the current text of the rule doesn't support it.

A maximum of 30 seconds is allowed to each player to make a throw after 1) the previous player has thrown; and, 2) the player has had a reasonable amount of time to arrive at the disc; and, 3) the playing area is clear and free of distractions.

I read that as once the clock starts, that's it. Once the player is at his lie and there are no distractions, the clock starts and there's no stopping it until the throw is made. If another distraction comes up, it's up to the player to either ignore it or try to wait it out based on whether or not he can stay within his 30 seconds. Maybe I'm just missing it, but show me where the book says the 30 seconds can be restarted.

 

[The Hammer]

I'd argue that there's no such thing at all as the clock resetting. I can't recall if this is something that used to be in the rule or just something that's always been assumed to be allowed, but the current text of the rule doesn't support it.

A maximum of 30 seconds is allowed to each player to make a throw after 1) the previous player has thrown; and, 2) the player has had a reasonable amount of time to arrive at the disc; and, 3) the playing area is clear and free of distractions.

I read that as once the clock starts, that's it. Once the player is at his lie and there are no distractions, the clock starts and there's no stopping it until the throw is made. If another distraction comes up, it's up to the player to either ignore it or try to wait it out based on whether or not he can stay within his 30 seconds. Maybe I'm just missing it, but show me where the book says the 30 seconds can be restarted.

If a distraction comes along inside that 30 seconds, then the playing area is not clear.

 

[Future_Primitive]

If anyone is on my card, feel free to finish the story. I'm playing golf, not running track; I can afford 3 minutes.

Just more selfish behavior, thanks for making a decision all by yourself that affects the entire tournament and pace of play. :doh:

 

[JoakimBL]

From the conversation, though, what it seems is that 30 seconds is not enough time (unless you have a straightforward lie). We are relying on the good will of men, or some hippy crap like that, to only call when the thrower is abusing it (not when it gains them a stroke to call). It seems pretty naive to me.

How many times were you called for this again? Oh right, NEVER!

 

[JoakimBL]

I'd argue that there's no such thing at all as the clock resetting. I can't recall if this is something that used to be in the rule or just something that's always been assumed to be allowed, but the current text of the rule doesn't support it.

A maximum of 30 seconds is allowed to each player to make a throw after 1) the previous player has thrown; and, 2) the player has had a reasonable amount of time to arrive at the disc; and, 3) the playing area is clear and free of distractions.

I read that as once the clock starts, that's it. Once the player is at his lie and there are no distractions, the clock starts and there's no stopping it until the throw is made. If another distraction comes up, it's up to the player to either ignore it or try to wait it out based on whether or not he can stay within his 30 seconds. Maybe I'm just missing it, but show me where the book says the 30 seconds can be restarted.

So if a group of kids runs into the fairway, it's just bad luck for the player?

 

[scarpfish]

Considering many of our courses aren't on dedicated land, its unreasonable to suggest that a player would have to choose between taking a warning/penalty stroke for excessive time versus risking injury to a non-participant who picked the wrong time to go down the park's walking path, particularly when their card mates didn't have to deal with that distraction. Granted, a degree of the lie assessment and whatnot can be done while you're waiting for the distraction to clear.

But for the record, last night at our local league, we were playing on a temporary alternate layout that I had set up to change things up a bit, and I get sent out on a sixsome card, which I heavily frown upon because it takes forever to finish. There were in fact two sixsome cards. Still, between the six of us and 391 strokes, (probably no more than 15 or so that were penalties), my card was able to finish the course in about two hours. That comes to less than 19 seconds per throw, and when you factor in walking time between holes, time looking for discs in tall grass, waiting time for scores, more waiting time to allow casuals playing the regular course to finish holes, it was actually much quicker than that.

So I think 30 seconds is plenty.

 

[NOStheBOSS]

See the shot, throw the shot. I rarely take more than 10 seconds to pick my disc, pick my shot, and throw it. Doing 30 practice "pumps" isn't going to make that putt go in

I think the time limit is subject to the player's control. If they're ready to throw the shot, then they have x amount of time. Sometimes you have to wait for another hole to putt or for kids to clear the fairway. That isn't the player's fault. Wind, difficulty of shot, etc. are the responsibility of the player and fall within the time limit

 

[Dan Ensor]

Just more selfish behavior, thanks for making a decision all by yourself that affects the entire tournament and pace of play. :doh:

So we better have a 30 second clock going for every throw. Wouldn't want a group decision to affect the entire tournament and pace of play. Dude just got kicked in the balls, but sorry, don't want to be selfish; that's a stroke.

 

[DavidSauls]

I'd argue that there's no such thing at all as the clock resetting. I can't recall if this is something that used to be in the rule or just something that's always been assumed to be allowed, but the current text of the rule doesn't support it.

A maximum of 30 seconds is allowed to each player to make a throw after 1) the previous player has thrown; and, 2) the player has had a reasonable amount of time to arrive at the disc; and, 3) the playing area is clear and free of distractions.

I read that as once the clock starts, that's it. Once the player is at his lie and there are no distractions, the clock starts and there's no stopping it until the throw is made. If another distraction comes up, it's up to the player to either ignore it or try to wait it out based on whether or not he can stay within his 30 seconds. Maybe I'm just missing it, but show me where the book says the 30 seconds can be restarted.

I read "after....free of distractions..." to mean, when there are distractions, you have 30 seconds after them to throw. "Distractions", being plural, can mean more than one.

So if you have a series of walkers cross the fairway, you don't have 30 seconds from the time the first one clears---you have a 30 second, distraction-free window. Which, though the exact words can be parsed otherwise, I'm certain is the intent.

 

[who-dat]

Wow, this thread is still going on?

 

[The Hammer]

ITT: Much ado about nothing

 

[bradharris]

So we better have a 30 second clock going for every throw. Wouldn't want a group decision to affect the entire tournament and pace of play. Dude just got kicked in the balls, but sorry, don't want to be selfish; that's a stroke.

What??

We don't want a three minute story on the tee holding up the pace of play. Now stop kicking your card mates in the balls and just throw!

 

[rd.bittle]

Can we kick the three minute story teller??

 

[araytx]

I'd argue that there's no such thing at all as the clock resetting. I can't recall if this is something that used to be in the rule or just something that's always been assumed to be allowed, but the current text of the rule doesn't support it.

A maximum of 30 seconds is allowed to each player to make a throw after 1) the previous player has thrown; and, 2) the player has had a reasonable amount of time to arrive at the disc; and, 3) the playing area is clear and free of distractions.

I read that as once the clock starts, that's it. Once the player is at his lie and there are no distractions, the clock starts and there's no stopping it until the throw is made. If another distraction comes up, it's up to the player to either ignore it or try to wait it out based on whether or not he can stay within his 30 seconds. Maybe I'm just missing it, but show me where the book says the 30 seconds can be restarted.

If a distraction comes along inside that 30 seconds, then the playing area is not clear.

Now that I look at it I kinda agree with JC. Maximum of 30 seconds. If at 20 seconds in the kids run in the middle of the fairway or a park walker shows up right in the area you're about to throw to, then I give you that you shouldn't throw right then. But when those two distractions are gone, you now have 10 more seconds until your maximum of 30. I think if they had meant an "uninterrupted" 30-second window then the word "maximum" wouldn't be neccessary.

 

[Future_Primitive]

So we better have a 30 second clock going for every throw. Wouldn't want a group decision to affect the entire tournament and pace of play. Dude just got kicked in the balls, but sorry, don't want to be selfish; that's a stroke.

My bad, I was under the impression you were out of grade school and might be able to argue your position instead of resorting to something as nonsensical as kicking someone in the balls to justify why you need 2 minutes to throw a 100 foot upshot from the fairway. Silly me. :doh:

 

[araytx]

So we better have a 30 second clock going for every throw. Wouldn't want a group decision to affect the entire tournament and pace of play. Dude just got kicked in the balls, but sorry, don't want to be selfish; that's a stroke.

I'm leaving San Francisco.

 

[bradharris]

Now that I look at it I kinda agree with JC. Maximum of 30 seconds. If at 20 seconds in the kids run in the middle of the fairway or a park walker shows up right in the area you're about to throw to, then I give you that you shouldn't throw right then. But when those two distractions are gone, you now have 10 more seconds until your maximum of 30.

No. The distraction breaks your rhythm and concentration. If you need 15 seconds to reset your feet, calm your breathing, go through a few pumps, you should not be penalized because you were interrupted the first time.

If I'm lining up a shot and a distraction like that comes along, I usually will step away from the lie and wait. If I had to stay in my stance, ready to throw as soon as the distraction cleared, I almost certainly would lose concentration and build unnecessary muscle tension while waiting and the next shot would suffer for it.

 

[Dan Ensor]

My bad, I was under the impression you were out of grade school and might be able to argue your position instead of resorting to something as nonsensical as kicking someone in the balls to justify why you need 2 minutes to throw a 100 foot upshot from the fairway. Silly me. :doh:

We're talking about telling a story, not throwing. So ... you should argue your point better. We were talking about a non-throwing delay, I brought up another one. Now you've brought up a throwing delay, which is not part of the discussion we were having.

 

[scarpfish]

Now that I look at it I kinda agree with JC. Maximum of 30 seconds. If at 20 seconds in the kids run in the middle of the fairway or a park walker shows up right in the area you're about to throw to, then I give you that you shouldn't throw right then. But when those two distractions are gone, you now have 10 more seconds until your maximum of 30.

The day I'd ever see such a situation have to be that finely officiated, I'm going to quit playing tournaments.

In all honestly, the guy who might take 45 seconds once or twice a round for a legitimate distraction is going to peeve me a whole lot less than one who needs even 15 seconds to make rudimentary upshot or putt every hole.