Another Rules Question. Stance.

[trifocal]

Here's the scenario. The 15th hole is 440 and I don't get a good throw off with my Boss. The throw is down the middle with fade, but was thrown too low and without enough speed to carry thru the dogleg left.

I'm in the middle of the fairway with 190 to the basket. I know I can't carry 190 with a static stance and the rules allow me a run-up....as long as my contact point prior to release is within 30cm ( about 12 inches ) of my mini marker.

So....I place my mini in front of the Boss and leave the Boss (21cm/ about 8 inches) on the ground. Then I go to my bag, pull a Buzz out, get a grip and a release angle figured', back up a step or two and walk into an x step. At my release/rip point my front foot/toe lands on the Boss. Disc lands 18' pin high...right of basket.

Legal throw?

 

[Roc1Time]

Here's the scenario. The 15th hole is 440 and I don't get a good throw off with my Boss. The throw is down the middle with fade, but was thrown too low and without enough speed to carry thru the dogleg left.

I'm in the middle of the fairway with 190 to the basket. I know I can't carry 190 with a static stance and the rules allow me a run-up....as long as my contact point prior to release is within 30cm ( about 12 inches ) of my mini marker.

So....I place my mini in front of the Boss and leave the Boss (21cm/ about 8 inches) on the ground. Then I go to my bag, pull a Buzz out, get a grip and a release angle figured', back up a step or two and walk into an x step. At my release/rip point my front foot/toe lands on the Boss. Disc lands 18' pin high...right of basket.

Legal throw?

Close enough for government work. A guy once told me if it was within a disc your good. I wouldnt think anyone would call you on that

 

[trifocal]

Close enough for government work. A guy once told me if it was within a disc your good. I wouldnt think anyone would call you on that

Was "That Guy" a jump putter? I'm kidding, Roc....what I am wondering is if I can use "The Rules" and mini placement to have...in effect...2 legal release points... 1. 30cm behind my mini and....lol... 2. a release point 30cm behind my Boss?


It actually makes a difference if I have a long fairway throw that requires a walk/run up. Its only a few inches, but given terrain and wind.....and the fact I'd really like to play within the rules.

 

[ERicJ]

At my release/rip point my front foot/toe lands on the Boss. Disc lands 18' pin high...right of basket.

Legal throw?

Interesting question. I think if you read through the PDGA Rules Q&A you can probably conclude that technically it's not legal.

That comes closest to the "Building a Lie" question which the rules committee has presently deemed not legal.

You could also consider the legal "Kneeling on a Towel" question as relevant, except that it specifically states that it's for the purpose of reducing abrasion and explicitly exempts supporting points of feet which should already be covered by shoes.

Many players haven't read rulebook, much less the Q&A, so like Roc1time said, it's not likely you'd get called on it.

 

[Roc1Time]

No you dont get both sorry dude. I cant read, I just type crap on boards for a hobby when Im not hitting aces. And using a towel is legal. Another one of those rules that people "think" too much about

 

[ERicJ]

Was "That Guy" a jump putter? I'm kidding, Roc....what I am wondering is if I can use "The Rules" and mini placement to have...in effect...2 legal release points... 1. 30cm behind my mini and....lol... 2. a release point 30cm behind my Boss?


It actually makes a difference if I have a long fairway throw that requires a walk/run up. Its only a few inches, but given terrain and wind.....and the fact I'd really like to play within the rules.

Once you place your mini it becomes the mark.

PDGA Rule 803.03 Marking the Lie

A. After each throw, the thrown disc must be left where it came to rest until the lie is established by the placing of a marker. This can be done by placing a mini marker disc on the playing surface between the hole and the disc, directly in line with the hole, on the line of play, touching the thrown disc. A player may instead choose, without touching or repositioning the thrown disc, to use the thrown disc as the marker. The marker may not be moved until the throw is released. A marker inadvertently moved prior to the throw shall be returned to its correct location.

You get one (thrown disc) or the other (mini), not both.

 

[ERicJ]

Dude if the disc was behind his mini he was within 30cm, did I read that right? If he did it by accident then its good.

Standing on a disc could be considered "building a lie" because your supporting point is not in contact with the playing surface.

And using a towel is legal.

A towel is legal under your feet only if you're on the teebox. His example was in the fairway.

 

[trifocal]

Interesting question. I think if you read through the PDGA Rules Q&A you can probably conclude that technically it's not legal.

That comes closest to the "Building a Lie" question which the rules committee has presently deemed not legal.

You could also consider the legal "Kneeling on a Towel" question as relevant, except that it specifically states that it's for the purpose of reducing abrasion and explicitly exempts supporting points of feet which should already be covered by shoes.

Many players haven't read rulebook, much less the Q&A, so like Roc1time said, it's not likely you'd get called on it.

Thanks, Eric....I kinda suspected that this wasn't quite kosher...technically. Personally, I just use this method....disc in place and mini....for my own reference to see how close my walk/run up actually places my contact point within 30cm. The thing about leaving a disc on the ground with a marker in place in front of it...is that it does give a very good impression of where the contact point is at release. If my foot is on the disc...I'm within 30 cm. If there is no disc behind the mini....well 30cm gets ambiguious...especially if I follow thru.

 

[Roc1Time]

Standing on a disc could be considered "building a lie" because your supporting point is not in contact with the playing surface.




A towel is legal under your feet only if you're on the teebox. His example was in the fairway.

Or under your knee if you have to kneel down and yes that rule has changed.

 

[80playedin10states]

guess its a good thing i can't see eric's posts here...ha ha ...a few guys i play with regularly do this(when it's dry) just because they are lazy? it is perfectly legal to step on the boss because you would be within the allowed distance from your mini..unless a boss is bigger than said distance..i assume you are talking about laying a towel on the tee pad where your plant foot is gonna be? i would hope that is legal since i have seen it in loads of wet tourneys..you couldn't release 30cm behind your boss though..

 

[trifocal]

There was another thread where I asked about using a flipped disc as my contact point. The scenario was it's wet and I want to throw a kneeling shot. The flipped disc is where I place my knee. And I believe...or seem to remember that using a disc to kneel on...didn't "build a lie"...it was..the thickness of a disc...was within the Rule Book Restrictions.

 

[Roc1Time]

There was another thread where I asked about using a flipped disc as my contact point. The scenario was it's wet and I want to throw a kneeling shot. The flipped disc is where I place my knee. And I believe...or seem to remember that using a disc to kneel on...didn't "build a lie"...it was..the thickness of a disc...was within the Rule Book Restrictions.

You are correct. What Eric is reading is the last line of the rule not the first. If you need to kneel down to putt or take and up shot or whatever off of the tee pad, yes you can use a towel. The last line says you cant kneel on a towel on the tee pad, but you can use a towel everywhere else.

 

[80playedin10states]

you can you put a towel down on the pad for your drive?...seen all the top pros doing this for years..could just be one of those rules noone cares to call?

 

[Roc1Time]

you can you put a towel down on the pad for your drive?...seen all the top pros doing this for years..could just be one of those rules noone cares to call?

Yes you can for where you are going to plant

 

[ERicJ]

You are correct. What Eric is reading is the last line of the rule not the first. If you need to kneel down to putt or take and up shot or whatever off of the tee pad, yes you can use a towel. The last line says you cant kneel on a towel on the tee pad, but you can use a towel everywhere else.

You can only use a towel under your feet when on the tee pad:

PDGA Q&A
Response: Applicable Rules - 802.04 Artificial Devices, 803.05 (Obstacles and Relief) C, 803.04 (Stance, Subsequent to Teeing Off) A.1 802.04 allows the use of items that reduce or control abrasion. Towels or pads may fulfill this purpose. Assuming that the unsafe items on the playing surface are not subject to removal or relief under PDGA rule 803.05.C (which covers relief from obstacles to one's stance), she is allowed to place a towel or small pad under any body part, with the exception of her feet (which should already be covered by protective devices such as shoes).
Note: She may move items under 803.05 C and also use a towel or small pad under her knee.
A "small pad" is defined as being 1 centimeter or less in thickness, when compressed.
Conclusion: One may use a towel or small pad (with a maximum compressed thickness of 1 centimeter) in order to prevent harm/abrasions to the body during competitive play. A towel or pad may be used under one's foot only on the tee box.

 

[trifocal]

I like the thread spin/twist, but I really want to know....can I leave a mini and a disc on the ground prior to a walkup/runup throw?

 

[80playedin10states]

pretty sure you can you just have to be within 30 cm of your mini when you release

 

[ERicJ]

There was another thread where I asked about using a flipped disc as my contact point. The scenario was it's wet and I want to throw a kneeling shot. The flipped disc is where I place my knee. And I believe...or seem to remember that using a disc to kneel on...didn't "build a lie"...it was..the thickness of a disc...was within the Rule Book Restrictions.

Kneeling on a towel is okay. Standing, i.e. feet, on a towel is not okay (unless you're on the tee pad).

 

[Roc1Time]

You can only use a towel under your feet when on the tee pad:

Yes

I like the thread spin/twist, but I really want to know....can I leave a mini and a disc on the ground prior to a walkup/runup throw?

Yes

pretty sure you can you just have to be within 30 cm of your mini when you release

And yes

 

[Roc1Time]

Kneeling on a towel is okay. Standing, i.e. feet, on a towel is not okay (unless you're on the tee pad).

And yes again, and I think I understand 80's beef with you. You just totally changed your stance from the first page and you make it kind of confusing for the people asking the questions.