Ball Golf Course Design Principles vs. DG course Design

[Thumber]

Should there a distance cutoff for par 3 or should it be based on amount of obstacles? Or a mix of the two?

The most common complaint I hear is that holes over 450 feet should be Par 4. Personally, I think it should be 500 feet or more, if it is a rather open hole.

It is dependent on many factors ....distance, obstacles, up or downhill, etc

I play on a mountain course with 550 foot par 3s that are downhill and, depending on the wind, may throw a buzz at it

 

[AJ_86]

Well, I'm in Florida, so everything is flat.

 

[Thumber]

Well, I'm in Florida, so everything is flat.

but you have those gnarly disc eating palm trees

 

[optidiscic]

but you have those gnarly disc eating palm trees gators, snakes and hurrican winds

fixed

 

[Thumber]

fixed

we have bears....they are a riot

 

[ironmon]

HH has the coolest obstacles, they are alive!

moving obstacles are pretty awesome
though hitting livestock can suck
turning an easy upshot into a bogie fast

if they are lingering behind the basket
they make for a great backstop.

it does get kinda wierd
when the course obstacles suddenly charge you
or give birth in front of you!

oh yeah... and steppin in or trying to play from their poop or afterbirth is a pretty intense hazard

 

[AJ_86]

fixed

Indeed. Plus sand that will swallow a white disc and mock your attempts to find it.

 

[Viper124]

The Ponds at Lakeshore is a ball golf course that's been converted to disc golf.

 

[AJ_86]

Fore Palms in Jacksonville is as well. It is an example of a good one.

Groves Park in Oak Ridge, TN is one... but I despise it. Bad tee positions, super long, super convoluted.

 

[fairweather_fan]

What is the ratio in bolf (love the term)? 4 par 5s, 8 par 4s and 6 par 3s?

4 par 3's, 10 par 4's, and 4 par 5's.

 

[Thumber]

4 par 3's, 10 par 4's, and 4 par 5's.

I would love to play a DG course with this ratio

 

[Sadjo]

I would love to play a DG course with this ratio

There's a meeting today with a ball golf course in SC to add Disc Golf along side the course. If the owners (whom I've known for 15 years) add Disc Golf, it will allow Disc Golf to be played at the same pars.

I think the length is somewhere in the 12,000' range. A par 71 if I remember correctly.

Disc Golf will have it's own tee areas and will have red and white tees to start. All greens and bunkers will play OB.

 

[optidiscic]

I would love to play a DG course with this ratio

As long as there are as many ace runs as par 5s I am happy

Too many par 4s is a grind and does not make for a pleasant day.

I hate a par 3 that can't be aced...usually a par 3.5 Bleh

I hate too many of the same par in a row

I love the thrill of Eagle and nothing is better than an ace or 3 great shots in a row on a par 5!

 

[optidiscic]

There's a meeting today with a ball golf course in SC to add Disc Golf along side the course. If the owners (whom I've known for 15 years) add Disc Golf, it will allow Disc Golf to be played at the same pars.

I think the length is somewhere in the 12,000' range. A par 71 if I remember correctly.

Disc Golf will have it's own tee areas and will have red and white tees to start. All greens and bunkers will play OB.

I don't think I'd like this as I have calculated through my own experience that full throttle driving beyond 36 times and a course becomes too reliant on driving and less reliant on approach and finesse.....I'd be willing to try it though and am curious how such a course would play. A bigger arm might not need to drive over 30 times on a 12,000 footer but I know I don't have that arm.

 

[Sadjo]

I'm only the one that put the meeting together. I used to play golf at the course years ago and have thrown discs there on occasion.

One of our local courses is long at 6,500' and at first I felt I had to go all out on every drive. But I began to learn it wasn't about the length off the tee but the placement of the shot that matter most. I now enjoy playing long courses.

I'll update as soon as I hear how the meeting went. If they go this direction, I will post pics of the holes.

 

[Cgkdisc]

This mix - Par 3s 6-8, Par 4s 7-10, Par 5s 2-3 - for total par in the 66-69 range is considered more appropriate for max par DG courses by several veteran designers (Duvall, Cummings, Doyle, Houck, Kennedy) who do gold level courses. Our difference from ball golf lies in the difference in the design variety available for par 3s. Par 3s in bolf are mostly the same in terms of flight path so they normally just have 4. Their challenge is primarily based on whatever hazards are on the ground.

Our par 3s can go up, down, left, right or straight thru several densities of foliage from tight to open. We have the potential to buzz the basket and ace much more often than in ball golf par 3s. Having those opportunities are part of the fun and challenge in the game you don't want to lose on high par courses. Some of the top gold courses by the above mentioned designers with DGCR ratings shown have this mix: Winthrop Gold 4.+ (par 68 - 7 par 3s), Lemon Lake Gold 4.00 (par 66 - 7 par 3s), Warwick 4.47 (par 67 - 8 par 3s), Jackson-IDGC 4.08 (par 68 - 6 par 3s), Highbridge Gold 4.71 (par 69 - 7 par 3s).

 

[optidiscic]

I think I agree with Chuck on this one
Ive played par 72 and while challenging not nearly as fun as a par 68....sounds weird but theres a difference

 

[Cgkdisc]

Almost forgot Moraine State Park 4.58 (par 66 - 8 par 3s) by J. Gary Dropcho who's another veteran among our gold course designers. Stan McDaniel is also among the veteran designers doing gold level courses but he leans more toward the ball golf model with Renny 4.21 (par 70 - 5 par 3s) and Charlotte's Web 3.97 (par 70 - 5 par 3s), but he's always been one of the more "sadistic" designers...

 

[Sadjo]

The course is in an area of high unemployment and the nearest Disc golf course is 45 minutes to an hour away. It will be a Fly18 project if it happens.

Having thrown the course before and knowing the possibilities, I think it will offer more trees in fairways and some decent elevation changes. One of the things that made me first talk to the guys that own it is the fact there is plenty of room to add Disc Golf without using all of the existing fairways. Holes could be played right along the fairways...just not in the fairways.

Anyway...my goal is to grow the sport but getting courses built. If this happens, it will be the 3rd I've sold or helped sell this year and the 5th in the last 18 months.

 

[lokirising]

I like obstacles that challenge you on your next shot if you end up in them. Tall grass rarely does that, it just eats discs and breeds chiggers. Bushes are a totally different story for me, I've never complained about thick brush/bushes off the fairway and I think they're a good way to punish errant throws.

Gives me an excuse to throw tomahawk with my Epic.