DGPT Drops New Media Outlook for 2019

[broomerang]

Let's remember that Vibram was not at the top of the disc golf world with Steve Dodge (and, and far as I understand it, not exactly an easy company to deal with from a wholesale standpoint either). I think Steve Dodge got out knowing the company was ending its disc golf line. Or at least read the writing on the wall. Let's not make the assumption that Vibram Disc Golf failed because the might Steve Dodge left.

The truth probably falls somewhere between:

Steve left because he wanted to do something else and Vibram couldn't carry on without him.

Steve was fired because Vibram was losing money on it's disc golf business.

It doesn't really matter to anyone other than Steve and Vibram. The DGPT could be successful even if Steve failed at Vibram and it could fail even if Steve was successful at Vibram.

Based on how open Ian and others inside the "biz" have declared their objection to this move by Steve I would say he will regret this decision.

I certainly have a lot more loyalty to Jomez and CCDG than I do the DGPT.

A few years ago the DGPT wasn't even around and now it's just a collection of established events and one end of year event that follows a new format.

Not to mention most people watched DGPT events because Jomez and CCDG and others where there to record them.

 

[Mocheez]

A few years ago the DGPT wasn't even around and now it's just a collection of established events and one end of year event that follows a new format.

They aren't all established events. 5 out of 11 were new... Jonesboro, Portland Open, Idlewild, San Francisco, and the DGPT Championships.

 

[broomerang]

They aren't all established events. 5 out of 11 were new... Jonesboro, Portland Open, Idlewild, San Francisco, and the DGPT Championships.

DGPT cannot claim they had anything to do with Idlewild or San Francisco Open being an A-Tier OR a successful event.

I don't have knowledge of the other 2 but I suspect the same would be accurate.

DGPT championship is the only one I will give credit to them for.

 

[Mocheez]

Jonesboro and Idlewild were B tiers in their first year. I doubt very much that 20+ top pros would have showed up to Jonesboro for a B tier if it wasn't a DGPT event.

 

[JC17393]

It is amazing to me the delusion some people have in this thread. DGPT has lower YT subscriber numbers BECAUSE they farmed out the post-production to CCDG and Jomez. People don't subscribe to things that don't have content they want. It appears Steve wants to put that desired content on his channel rather than someone else's. And if Jomez/CCDG won't do it under his banner, he'll get someone else. And people will watch. Because people want to watch the best players at big events.

The notion of players going to a "Jomez" tour is kinda laughable too. The only ones who might be motivated by the idea of being on Jomez and choosing their event over something like the DGPT are the top guys expecting to make lead cards consistently. If you're a player who makes the top 6-8 at the big events infrequently at best, you're going to go where the money is. If the DGPT events have the payouts, most players are going there. And if they're all the DGPT, who's filling out the field at those Jomez events? Sorry, just not buying the idea that players are going to flock to events motivated by getting filmed by a certain crew rather than seeking the best competition and ROI for their efforts on the course.

Really, this "oh poor Jomez/CCDG/Smashboxx" stuff is like saying "oh poor NBC" because ESPN/ABC sniped NBA coverage from them a few years back. People aren't watching the NBA to see Bob Costas. They're watching it to see Lebron and Curry. As great a job as Jomez and CCDG do with their coverage, I'm not watching for their editing and graphics and camera work. I'm watching to see Paul and Ricky and Simon and Nate and Eagle and James. I'm watching to see Paige and Sarah and Paige and Cat and Jessica and Lisa. Whatever channel has that, I'll watch.

 

[broomerang]

It is amazing to me the delusion some people have in this thread. DGPT has lower YT subscriber numbers BECAUSE they farmed out the post-production to CCDG and Jomez. People don't subscribe to things that don't have content they want. It appears Steve wants to put that desired content on his channel rather than someone else's. And if Jomez/CCDG won't do it under his banner, he'll get someone else. And people will watch. Because people want to watch the best players at big events.

The notion of players going to a "Jomez" tour is kinda laughable too. The only ones who might be motivated by the idea of being on Jomez and choosing their event over something like the DGPT are the top guys expecting to make lead cards consistently. If you're a player who makes the top 6-8 at the big events infrequently at best, you're going to go where the money is. If the DGPT events have the payouts, most players are going there. And if they're all the DGPT, who's filling out the field at those Jomez events? Sorry, just not buying the idea that players are going to flock to events motivated by getting filmed by a certain crew rather than seeking the best competition and ROI for their efforts on the course.

Really, this "oh poor Jomez/CCDG/Smashboxx" stuff is like saying "oh poor NBC" because ESPN/ABC sniped NBA coverage from them a few years back. People aren't watching the NBA to see Bob Costas. They're watching it to see Lebron and Curry. As great a job as Jomez and CCDG do with their coverage, I'm not watching for their editing and graphics and camera work. I'm watching to see Paul and Ricky and Simon and Nate and Eagle and James. I'm watching to see Paige and Sarah and Paige and Cat and Jessica and Lisa. Whatever channel has that, I'll watch.

We'll certainly see if that assertion is true next year.

 

[Darkgreen]

Seriously? Are people really clamoring for 3rd card+ coverage? Not me. I can barely make it through 4 round of lead card on some of those courses. Watching different people throwing the same line over and over ain't interesting.

Some of those courses. And I think that is it. Some courses and some tourneys I would love to see coverage 3 cards deep if the coverage execution is good. Other tourneys and courses I don't want to watch at all.

 

[SD86]

It's obviously all going to be carried on ESPN.

When I first heard about all this, my first thought was that DGPT is trying to do what Jussi tried to do with the DGWT and failed miserably. I always believed Jussi refused to have live coverage for the USDGC because he wanted to make and sell a media 'package' to ESPN or someone. But he made huge mistakes along the way, so the dream died a painful death. :|

Now DGPT is trying to consolidate their video package under their own roof. Why? I don't think it's just to get more YouTube views.

DGWT 2.0? opcorn:

 

[JTacoma03]

When I first heard about all this, my first thought was that DGPT is trying to do what Jussi tried to do with the DGWT and failed miserably. I always believed Jussi refused to have live coverage for the USDGC because he wanted to make and sell a media 'package' to ESPN or someone. But he made huge mistakes along the way, so the dream died a painful death. :|

Now DGPT is trying to consolidate their video package under their own roof. Why? I don't think it's just to get more YouTube views.

DGWT 2.0? opcorn:

All these years later you still have no idea what happened, and you're still spreading false info.

Not gonna argue about it, because it's been hashed and re-hashed. But so much of your post is completely incorrect.

 

[mizunodave]

All of these comments about Steve doing this to steal all that sweet disc golf coverage money are laughable. Getting rich has no part of the motivation for these moves. All Steve wants is the tour to survive and grow. He thinks this is the best way. Is he right? We'll see.

I call BS on the people who say they aren't going to watch DGPT out of loyalty to Jonathan and Ian. You'll watch where the players are playing that you want to see. The pros deciding what tournaments to play are where the leverage is to decide how this shakes out.

 

[lenfantsuave]

Really, this "oh poor Jomez/CCDG/Smashboxx" stuff is like saying "oh poor NBC" because ESPN/ABC sniped NBA coverage from them a few years back. People aren't watching the NBA to see Bob Costas. They're watching it to see Lebron and Curry. As great a job as Jomez and CCDG do with their coverage, I'm not watching for their editing and graphics and camera work. I'm watching to see Paul and Ricky and Simon and Nate and Eagle and James. I'm watching to see Paige and Sarah and Paige and Cat and Jessica and Lisa. Whatever channel has that, I'll watch.

I would contend that this is not 100% accurate. I watch Jomez because it is a complete package. Awesome production value with great commentary and awesome disc golf.

I think your comparison to the large networks needs some work too. NBC has by far the best production of any of the major networks when it comes to the nfl. And the ratings reflect that.

But this is not a multi billion dollar industry. So people are still going to apply altruistic values to their judgement of the situation.

 

[JC17393]

I would contend that this is not 100% accurate. I watch Jomez because it is a complete package. Awesome production value with great commentary and awesome disc golf.

I think your comparison to the large networks needs some work too. NBC has by far the best production of any of the major networks when it comes to the nfl. And the ratings reflect that.

But this is not a multi billion dollar industry. So people are still going to apply altruistic values to their judgement of the situation.

NBC owes a lot of their high NFL ratings to the fact that they're on Sunday night, have zero competition for NFL viewers (only game on to watch), and generally get match-ups of interest to wider audiences. They may have great production values (getting to concentrate on one game per week certainly makes a difference), but it isn't why people are tuning in.

If the NFL awarded CBS or Fox a concurrent game on Sunday nights, people would pick what they watch based on who was playing, not what network it was on. Which game, if aired at the same time, would get higher ratings: Cowboys-Patriots on Fox or Browns-Raiders on NBC? If you say Browns-Raiders due to NBC's production value, you're fooling yourself.

Jomez is great. They've busted their ass to be the #1 venue for disc golf videos, but at the same time, they've been handed a lot of great content to drive their views. The notion that they'll get the same kind of view counts filming some random A-tier versus the lead card at Memorial or Ledgestone or Maple Hill because of production values is foolish on its face.

 

[Mspot]

All of these comments about Steve doing this to steal all that sweet disc golf coverage money are laughable. Getting rich has no part of the motivation for these moves. All Steve wants is the tour to survive and grow. He thinks this is the best way. Is he right? We'll see.

I call BS on the people who say they aren't going to watch DGPT out of loyalty to Jonathan and Ian. You'll watch where the players are playing that you want to see. The pros deciding what tournaments to play are where the leverage is to decide how this shakes out.

Seriously? Have you not heard the rumors that Steve is actually a Russian spy that has been embezzling millions of dollars from the DGPT.... And that the DGPT is actually just a cover up for a plan to take over the world.

 

[Cgkdisc]

The "elephants" still in the shadows are the TDs and their teams who make little to nothing to losing money and time hosting these tour events. It's only a matter of time where TDs and clubs won't want to take the time and raise the added cash for these big pro tour events without getting more compensation versus running big amateur only events like BG where the financial model is more sustainable.

 

[JTacoma03]

All of these comments about Steve doing this to steal all that sweet disc golf coverage money are laughable. Getting rich has no part of the motivation for these moves. All Steve wants is the tour to survive and grow. He thinks this is the best way. Is he right? We'll see.

I call BS on the people who say they aren't going to watch DGPT out of loyalty to Jonathan and Ian. You'll watch where the players are playing that you want to see. The pros deciding what tournaments to play are where the leverage is to decide how this shakes out.

If you're referring to my comment, I didn't say he stole anything. I speculated that he wants a cut of the work the content creators did to raise their brand awareness. It takes a ton of work to build a social media brand, corporations have entire departments devoted to this practice now. There's a new title in the board room even - CCO - stands for Chief Content Officer.

Essentially, the move signals to me that he is betting that at least 1 of these 2 things are true:

1) The DGPT brand is stronger than the media brands, and has a more loyal following.

2) The raw footage of the players throwing is more valuable alone than as a part of the finished product.


For my part, I fundamentally disagree with both of those notions, and I believe that the evidence points my way.

 

[brutalbrutus]

BTW, who says Jomez has to run a "competing" tour. I would think they would smart enough to use the off weeks...There are already plenty of Atiers in between tour events that get a couple top pros. If they could drum up some added cash and the draw of being filmed, more guys would play these types of events and the ones that are, would be drawn together at them instead of spreading out to multiple events. Maybe not the top5 guys but there are plenty of intriguing players in the top50...

 

[riltim]

The Jomez Final 9 with Dion Arlyn has as many YouTube views and the 2018 DGPT finals from the Disc Golf Pro Tour channel.

Steve Dodge may be many things but a smaet businessman he is not. Can someone fill me in; what's his success rate?

 

[lyleoross]

Let's remember that Vibram was not at the top of the disc golf world with Steve Dodge (and, and far as I understand it, not exactly an easy company to deal with from a wholesale standpoint either). I think Steve Dodge got out knowing the company was ending its disc golf line. Or at least read the writing on the wall. Let's not make the assumption that Vibram Disc Golf failed because the might Steve Dodge left.

I am never ever going to say Steve Dodge again... without inserting mighty in front of his name.

 

[lyleoross]

The Jomez Final 9 with Dion Arlyn has as many YouTube views and the 2018 DGPT finals from the Disc Golf Pro Tour channel.

Steve Dodge may be many things but a smaet businessman he is not. Can someone fill me in; what's his success rate?

Actually, as a promoter, he's done pretty darned well. But as a video guy, relatively poorly.

 

[lyleoross]

BTW, who says Jomez has to run a "competing" tour. I would think they would smart enough to use the off weeks...There are already plenty of Atiers in between tour events that get a couple top pros. If they could drum up some added cash and the draw of being filmed, more guys would play these types of events and the ones that are, would be drawn together at them instead of spreading out to multiple events. Maybe not the top5 guys but there are plenty of intriguing players in the top50...

Very interesting idea. I know they often get some money from TDs. I wonder if an event could add a $5 fee to see how it would impact sign ups etc.?