Highbridge Hills - Wisconsin

[BuzzzFlicker87]

But disc golf courses are not self sustainable. From our collective, selfish perspective, that is what we might like to see be the priority, but that is not realistic. I think developing the land to provider for a revenue source to support the disc golf is a more feasible business plan.

Getting water, electricity and gas available would likely be an important foundation for any future.

My group comes up annually going on 5 years now. Collectively we give John about $2000 for our weekend stay at the Honka and theres always other groups out there. I think disc golf could generate enough to sustain itself while maintaining the grounds for events such as InfraSound which must bring in serious revenue. This place could be the best disc golf complex in the world. It has spectacular views, elevation changes, and a secluded environment which is refreshing compared to city park courses. Chuck did a spectacular job designing this complex to offer a course for every skill level. Sure you can go camp somewhere else, but campgrounds feel cramped, and you will be monitored closely on state or federal land. A private campground on a disc golf course would be a much better spot to party and cut loose which I think appeals to the disc golf demographic. Did I mention golfing after dark with a cold beverage in hand??? John wants a pity party and will tell you how tough it is out here but I don't buy that garbage. People already come from all over the country to play here even with the turmoil, drama, and lack of maintenance. I got 5+ years in ball golf course maintenance, currently work in tree care/logging, and been hucking golf disc since I was 15. I would love a chance to maintain this place and see it reach its potential whether that is in a leadership position or not.

 

[[email protected]]

Highbridge

My group comes up annually going on 5 years now. Collectively we give John about $2000 for our weekend stay at the Honka and theres always other groups out there. I think disc golf could generate enough to sustain itself while maintaining the grounds for events such as InfraSound which must bring in serious revenue. This place could be the best disc golf complex in the world. It has spectacular views, elevation changes, and a secluded environment which is refreshing compared to city park courses. Chuck did a spectacular job designing this complex to offer a course for every skill level. Sure you can go camp somewhere else, but campgrounds feel cramped, and you will be monitored closely on state or federal land. A private campground on a disc golf course would be a much better spot to party and cut loose which I think appeals to the disc golf demographic. Did I mention golfing after dark with a cold beverage in hand??? John wants a pity party and will tell you how tough it is out here but I don't buy that garbage. People already come from all over the country to play here even with the turmoil, drama, and lack of maintenance. I got 5+ years in ball golf course maintenance, currently work in tree care/logging, and been hucking golf disc since I was 15. I would love a chance to maintain this place and see it reach its potential whether that is in a leadership position or not.

. Please get in touch. [email protected]

 

[ru4por]

My group comes up annually going on 5 years now. Collectively we give John about $2000 for our weekend stay at the Honka and theres always other groups out there. I think disc golf could generate enough to sustain itself while maintaining the grounds for events such as InfraSound which must bring in serious revenue. This place could be the best disc golf complex in the world. It has spectacular views, elevation changes, and a secluded environment which is refreshing compared to city park courses. Chuck did a spectacular job designing this complex to offer a course for every skill level. Sure you can go camp somewhere else, but campgrounds feel cramped, and you will be monitored closely on state or federal land. A private campground on a disc golf course would be a much better spot to party and cut loose which I think appeals to the disc golf demographic. Did I mention golfing after dark with a cold beverage in hand??? John wants a pity party and will tell you how tough it is out here but I don't buy that garbage. People already come from all over the country to play here even with the turmoil, drama, and lack of maintenance. I got 5+ years in ball golf course maintenance, currently work in tree care/logging, and been hucking golf disc since I was 15. I would love a chance to maintain this place and see it reach its potential whether that is in a leadership position or not.

I have no doubt of the potential to be a disc golf mecca. I think getting to the point where disc golf was close to a break even proposition, even in the very best of situations, is very unique in our sport. I am not a course owner, but there are plenty on this site. Maybe they could lend some perspective. Until then, we will have to disagree.

You are preaching to the choir with the rest of the post. :thmbup:

 

[da Crippler]

A Highbridge complex with revenue from disc golf, camping, cabin rentals, pro shop, tournaments, leagues, winter activities like XC skiing and tubing, music festivals and other events could make it sustainable with the right management.

 

[DavidSauls]

I have no doubt of the potential to be a disc golf mecca. I think getting to the point where disc golf was close to a break even proposition, even in the very best of situations, is very unique in our sport. I am not a course owner, but there are plenty on this site. Maybe they could lend some perspective. Until then, we will have to disagree.

You are preaching to the choir with the rest of the post. :thmbup:

It's more of a business question than a course question.

What capital expenses are needed to construct facilities? Utilities, campground, cabins, etc. You've got to be able to cover that, plus interest, plus profit.

What ongoing expenses would be needed? It's more than just mowing the course. Staffing, if you're expecting lots of people. You've got to take in enough money to pay staff, pay ongoing expenses like equipment repairs, pay licensing, permits, and taxes, insurance, etc., pay the capital expenses, plus profit.

Are we talking about covering land costs, or even interest and taxes on the land, out of this venture?

How many disc golfers would it take to generate this sort of income? And would they come year-round, in northern Wisconsin, or do they all have to show up in season?

 

[markmcc]

I am spending my summer in Maine, where every course I've played is pay-to-play. While some of them are clearly backyard courses where you shove your money through a slot in the garage door, many are dedicated courses with pro shops, at least minimal staffing, and well-maintained courses. Three that immediately come to mind are Sabattus and Bittersweer Ridge near Portland and DR Disc Golf near Bangor. These each have multiple courses, pro shops (especially nice at Sabattus and Bittersweet Ridge) and office staff who greet you, take your money, etc.

I have no idea of what their situations are with respect to land ownership, taxes, etc. but each of these seems to be a legitimate business with little or nothing else sustaining the operation. I know that they have robust league play which occurs several days/nights a week and obviously relies on local golfers. I wonder if this is a big part of their operation and if that piece of the puzzle would be missing at Highbridge due to low population density in the area.

 

[DavidSauls]

The right mix of a great course, decent disc golfer population, and lack of free quality courses nearby, can make it work.

For those suggesting bigger infrastructure---campgrounds with hookups and showers, cabins---the expenses are higher. They can work, like free-standing campgrounds, if they can generate enough business. It's just a lot of business they have to generate.

 

[steinkecm]

Plenty of other courses/complexes make themselves self sustainable somehow. If the courses have the potential everyone says they do, Highbridge should be no different.

 

[Leonidas187]

I can think of two in Minnesota that are sustaining, right near each other. Looking at all the information I have, DG is a big thing here in Wisco and the Sota. You look at this board, or other web based sites out there dedicated to DG, and you'd think the two states would be giving Emporia a run for it's money. I'm a lucky man as my partner is also avid about the sport, HBH is one of the places on our list of courses we are going to (3 hours away), and I don't see any reason, with the right mgt. and the right marketing that HBH could be the place we want it to be. I hope they get it worked out...

 

[jeremyhilss]

See keeping this place in pristine shape would NOT take all the miracles people are saying it would take. Here's a couple things that could be done right now to get the place in prime (not just ok like it is now) disc golf shape. Hell I'd do it my damn self if I knew John wouldn't screw it up again:

1) Clear all the junk, woodpiles, half finsihed projects out of the way and view of all the fairways, and KEEP IT THAT WAY

2) Trim up the really overgrown tree branches that are completely blocking the airways on some holes (Granite 15 and Bear 10 come to mind)

3) This would cost money, but not a fortune - pour cement to stabilize certain baskets on Woodland, fix the bent/half crushed Gold 14 basket, and pull as many baskets from Chestnut that are the same, and put em' on Bear. Get those AWFUL green ones out of there.

4) Whomever is running reservations, whenever liscenses are renewed/purchased, whatever, mark which camping/lodging spot is taken on a calendar so as not to double book.

5) Communicate event dates and goings on on social media effectively (not through 3 seperated HBH pages and personal accounts).

Do this and you bring the quiality of a HBH visit from a 6 to a 9. Guranteed. If you disagree please tell me how this WOULDN'T work (for at least pure disc golfing experience).

 

[DavidSauls]

. If you disagree please tell me how this WOULDN'T work (for at least pure disc golfing experience).

I was generally talking about the suggestions that go beyond the pure disc golfing experience.

Such as building campgrounds, cabins, etc., and operating them.

What does it cost, in time and money, to keep the courses mown and trimmed? I have a general idea. If the labor is free (manager or volunteers), it's easier to sustain the costs; if you're paying someone, you need that many more players.

If the disc golf doesn't have to pay for the land, or taxes on it, that helps too.

 

[jeremyhilss]

I was generally talking about the suggestions that go beyond the pure disc golfing experience.

Such as building campgrounds, cabins, etc., and operating them.

What does it cost, in time and money, to keep the courses mown and trimmed? I have a general idea. If the labor is free (manager or volunteers), it's easier to sustain the costs; if you're paying someone, you need that many more players.

If the disc golf doesn't have to pay for the land, or taxes on it, that helps too.

For sure, I agree. My statement was more or less a blanket statement about the overall disc golf that I've been thinking about for awhile, not necessarily related to the camping/amenities/business discussion.

And I WOULD be the volunteer (I have been in the past) if there was someone more level headed running the courses themselves.

 

[tomdizzlefizzle]

I am thinking of driving up here this weekend. What should I expect course conditions wise? I have a friend with land basically on hole 2 of blueberry so I'm not concerned about accommodations. Is that rave done? Will I be able to play? Do I have to give back rubs or drugs to that woman? Thanks in advance

 

[J-Bright]

I'm still confused on this. After thanking John (HBH Facebook account) for the refund on the deposit, I wished him well. He basically said it's been very tough lately with County Officials but he is getting by thus far. I have no idea as to what context any of this means, but still have no idea who Roger and Ann are and who is running it unless they are out to take over for John?

 

[roggenb3]

I am thinking of driving up here this weekend. What should I expect course conditions wise? I have a friend with land basically on hole 2 of blueberry so I'm not concerned about accommodations. Is that rave done? Will I be able to play? Do I have to give back rubs or drugs to that woman? Thanks in advance

Your friend owns land on BB2? Like where the old BB2 cabin was? That's interesting.

I believe Infra is over. I would expect decent conditions based on the fact that it was great pre-rave....but it's always a gamble. John usually posts FB pics when he is done mowing a course - I'd check there for recent updates.

 

[juju]

If I stopped by and played without paying, would there be any issues? I'm not gonna pay for a course that isn't maintained.

 

[in4d]

Plenty of other courses/complexes make themselves self sustainable somehow. If the courses have the potential everyone says they do, Highbridge should be no different.

and with the number and quality of the courses, it should be able to do better

 

[tbird888]

If I stopped by and played without paying, would there be any issues? I'm not gonna pay for a course that isn't maintained.

I hope this is sarcasm. Wisconsin is littered with free courses. You don't have to steal.

 

[markmcc]

I wonder if folks are underestimating the importance of a significant local population of disc golfers? The successful, stand-alone P2P courses that I've seen are hosting a lot of leagues, tournaments, clinics and other events that keep the locals coming in day after day and week after week. One of the Maine courses that I visited hosted an indoor putting league in the winter and even DG Playstation (or some video system) tournaments. The Tuesday evening I played Bittersweet they had 32 folks show up for random draw doubles.

I've not played HH but it sounds like they may not have much of a local population and would be relying primarily on travelers. I imagine that is a much tougher business model to make work.

 

[tomdizzlefizzle]

Your friend owns land on BB2? Like where the old BB2 cabin was? That's interesting.

I believe Infra is over. I would expect decent conditions based on the fact that it was great pre-rave....but it's always a gamble. John usually posts FB pics when he is done mowing a course - I'd check there for recent updates.

Yeah he purchased a plot from someone who was planning on highbridge being a ball golf course. If you shank your shot to the left of hole 2 blueberry you will be on his property. He never uses it but doesn't want to sell. I'll check face plant for more info. Thank you