[Latitude] Lat64 "Havoc" and "Pain"?

[jimbosprint]

I just got to take my new177 GL Pain out yesterday and it is just what I was looking for! I like that it says "Reliable Overstable Midrange" right on top. Amazing plastic. :thmbup:

BrotherDave: Don't you have a Buzzz for that?

 

[BrotherDave]

BrotherDave: Don't you have a Buzzz for that?

No, every time I get a nice Buzzz I seem to trade it away for something better. I was using a 165 Nebula but I'm trying to cut down on molds. If I can cover all my mids with Pains and Fuses I'll be a happy boy.

 

[smarkquart]

One thing I have noticed about Gold Line Havocs is that when they fly into snow, they do not leave any marks. I have lost two in the last four days. One I will probably never see again, the other is at least in a field where it should be safe until the snow thaws. I should be able to get that one back.

I love the way they fly, I just hate losing them on GOOD throws (not that I want to lose them if they were bad throws).

 

[Rol6566]

I have had a couple throws with it so my experience is limited. But the throws i had, I was impressed. With a good snap, they held a sweet hyzer line or straight with a decent fade. Atleast for me, when powered down, they became almost meat hook at about 200' or less of power.

I have a 176 opto if that matters.

 

[Overpar]

I find myself reaching for my Pain more than my Core and Fuse now. As said before, the finish is very reliable and with the right touch and power you can shape so very nice lines with it. Love it for those short wooded tunnel shots.

 

[Handsome Rob]

I find myself reaching for my Pain more than my Core and Fuse now. As said before, the finish is very reliable and with the right touch and power you can shape so very nice lines with it. Love it for those short wooded tunnel shots.

Second that. I like that same reliable finish for wind while on the approach.

 

[jrawk]

I find myself reaching for my Pain more than my Core and Fuse now. As said before, the finish is very reliable and with the right touch and power you can shape so very nice lines with it. Love it for those short wooded tunnel shots.

Stand me in front of a tunnel shot, tell me i have to throw backhand, and give me a choice between overstable and understable mids.... i'm pick'n the understable. Fuses were made for tunnels.

 

[Handsome Rob]

Stand me in front of a tunnel shot, tell me i have to throw backhand, and give me a choice between overstable and understable mids.... i'm pick'n the understable. Fuses were made for tunnels.

I also prefer the fuse in a tunnel situation over the more stable/overstable mid range counterparts.

 

[khmer]

Stand me in front of a tunnel shot, tell me i have to throw backhand, and give me a choice between overstable and understable mids.... i'm pick'n the understable. Fuses were made for tunnels.

I second this :thmbup:

 

[chickenonabun]

^ I would prefer the understable one probably because I could hyzer flip it better, and I would probably try to throw the OS one flat and OAT the **** out of it and turn it over a lot. 0_o

 

[yawpstang64]

Pain Weight Differences

What sort of flight differences between min and max weight (approx 166/178) Pains has anyone noticed?

 

[Huk Finn]

The heavier ones fade earlier, and the lighter ones are easier to turnover.

 

[gwillim]

gotta throw my $.02 in on the Pain...

I picked up a 176g Opto Pain from Next Adventure (Portland) earlier last week. I finally got a chance to test it out yesterday. I've been looking for a more durable replacement for my KC Rocs, which I'm tired of having to replace every couple of months as they lose stability. Essentially, I want a champion Roc, but don't want to pay the extra $ for them. I used to throw the Wasp years ago, but Dcraft stopped making them the way that I like them back around 2004.

Long Story short, I'm REALLY liking the Pain! It is VERY overstable and can handle a ton of torque (getting it out to 360'+). If I had to summarize it with comparisons I would say that it's 2/3 KC Roc and 1/3 Gator. If thrown nice and hard (and smooth of course) it will hold a very straight line for the front 3/4 of flight, then hyzer nice and predictably the last 1/4. Comparing it to a driver, I'd have to say that it looks pretty simlar to a Pred in flight.

Glide. It's got glide, one thing that the Wasp lost back in 04-05 when they stopped making them domey. I feel the glide is comparable to the KC Roc, maybe even a hint more?

In summary, I'm not 100% sold yet, but I have taken all of my KC Rocs out of the bag and I'm comfy playing with the Pain as my sole overstable mid while I further evaluate, and I'm excited.

 

[Huk Finn]

^^^
That's a pretty good assessment.

 

[jgillia]

Question for you other Pain throwers. I received my first Opto Pain a lil over a week ago and love it. Its a 173 yellow/dayglow and it does have a little highspeed turn. Its still plenty stable but I cant turn it over pretty easily and flex shots are a dream with this disc. However, I recently just obtained two more Opto Pain (172 blue and 175 magenta) and they both have a higher PLH by a good bit with the 172 Blue being the highest. Im wondering how everyone elses Pains fly? I also wonder which is the norm, Im thinking the higher PLH ones. I have yet to throw them but Im pretty sure just by the PLH alone my two new ones are going to be more HSS than my dayglow.

I may have to track down some more lower PLH Pains and they are a blast to throw and the PERFECT compliment to my Comets.

 

[i_throw_bricks]

Mine is a little less overstable than billed, but I have yet to compare PLH. I love the disc, though. It's very dependable and gives a long left dog leg out to about 250 with very little effort. For the holes that call for it off the tee, this disc is an almost guaranteed birdie for because of it's consistency. It just doesn't handle headwinds as well as I had hoped. I really need something that can handle 20+ mph headwinds, and this is not it. I am hoping to try a Zone or Demon soon.

 

[jdw80550]

^^^Zone and Drone for what it's worth

 

[smarkquart]

In an attempt to simplify my bag, a few months ago I went down to three mid molds: Buzzz SS, Buzzz, and a Vector. The Vector did its job for overstable short approaches and placements, but never got the glide and distance I was hoping for when it replaced my Z Drones. After someone found my ESP Meteor that had been missing for 1 1/2 years and I ended up throwing it a few times to see what kind of condition it was in, I (re)discovered there was too much overlap between the SS and the regular Buzzz.

Suddenly not pleased with the Vector's range because I was becoming very comfortable with the Meteor and Buzzz combo again, I had to make a decision between the Pain and the Hornet. I never really felt confident with the ESP Hornet despite knowing the Z and ESP are different discs. So I ended up going with the Pain because of the tremendous glide most other Lat discs have.

Initially I was very disappointed with the Pain. It was not as overstable as I had hoped. It still has a solid fade but it has so much glide that it gets more forward penetration than I expected and the fade only comes in very late.

So what I have done is gone back up to four molds: Meteor, Buzzz, Pain, and Z Drones. I do not like the idea of my bag swelling again, but this really is a good line-up. With the Pain not being forced into overstable placement but still offering better fading lines than a Buzzz, the Pain has shown some great potential as a driving mid with hyzer or thrown hard and flat so it can rocket into tight spaces and not turn over. Since the Pain has so much glide I will not use it to approach the basket. This also means that if I were to sacrifice a disc from my bag, it would be the Pain unfortunately.

I am glad I have found what the Pain is good at because my short game had been suffering the last month, which is normally the strongest part of my game. Over the last year I had a knack for taking the worst drives and still saving them for par attempts.

 

[khmer]

In an attempt to simplify my bag, a few months ago I went down to three mid molds: Buzzz SS, Buzzz, and a Vector. The Vector did its job for overstable short approaches and placements, but never got the glide and distance I was hoping for when it replaced my Z Drones. After someone found my ESP Meteor that had been missing for 1 1/2 years and I ended up throwing it a few times to see what kind of condition it was in, I (re)discovered there was too much overlap between the SS and the regular Buzzz.

Suddenly not pleased with the Vector's range because I was becoming very comfortable with the Meteor and Buzzz combo again, I had to make a decision between the Pain and the Hornet. I never really felt confident with the ESP Hornet despite knowing the Z and ESP are different discs. So I ended up going with the Pain because of the tremendous glide most other Lat discs have.

Initially I was very disappointed with the Pain. It was not as overstable as I had hoped. It still has a solid fade but it has so much glide that it gets more forward penetration than I expected and the fade only comes in very late.

So what I have done is gone back up to four molds: Meteor, Buzzz, Pain, and Z Drones. I do not like the idea of my bag swelling again, but this really is a good line-up. With the Pain not being forced into overstable placement but still offering better fading lines than a Buzzz, the Pain has shown some great potential as a driving mid with hyzer or thrown hard and flat so it can rocket into tight spaces and not turn over. Since the Pain has so much glide I will not use it to approach the basket. This also means that if I were to sacrifice a disc from my bag, it would be the Pain unfortunately.

I am glad I have found what the Pain is good at because my short game had been suffering the last month, which is normally the strongest part of my game. Over the last year I had a knack for taking the worst drives and still saving them for par attempts.

What are you looking for your mid or overstable mid to do or accomplish?

 

[smarkquart]

What are you looking for your mid or overstable mid to do or accomplish?

My Buzzz and Meteor are exactly what I am looking for in their respective slots, but I am also looking for something for about 250-280 feet when thrown hard and flat totally ignores the wind and finishes with a solid fade, or for the same distance can hyzer spike around objects. At that power the Buzzz is fairly straight or requires a lot of height and room out to the right so it can be given a hyzer. It is a very niche shot but it happens quite often at the courses I play.

The Drone has the right flight lines, but I am looking for a little more distance. Basically then I am looking for just a tad less HSS but almost the same LSS. The Vector never got that distance and basically did all the same shots as the Drone. The Pain is considerably less HSS meaning that by the time the LSS kicks in, I am still to the right of my intended target.

Basically I am looking for that magical overstable mid. I can power down on my fairway drivers but I do not like to do this under 280 feet because at that distance they often have a tendency to skip and bounce whereas a mid is more likely going to dig. More basically I am looking for a mid I can power up without having to worry too much about OAT or how much hyzer it is going to need to keep from flipping up or having too much and ditching into the ground.