Boycott the USDGC?

[atl scott]

I watched 16 minutes of the video. I don't really disagree with much JP has to say except that he says it should still be called the USDGC for logistical reasons. He then goes on to say it's nice to see people excited about winning a "national championship" and a few seconds later that it's not the same event and that they have to figure out a way to differentiate between the types of champions. It just doesn't make any sense. It's not the USDGC, don't call it the USDGC, and don't get rid of the USDGC that we all love so much.

Would have been nice if they could have held this new event the week before the actual tournament and kept the real deal in place for those like Kenny etc to get another X by their name.

 

[Cgkdisc]

The next USDGC will be the biggest joke of a tourney in disc golf history.

Having played in a USDGC, those who play in it will have the best experience ever in an event. It really doesn't matter what you or anyone else thinks who's not playing. Isn't this sport basically about how enjoyable your personal experiences can be whether casual or tournament play and not what anyone else thinks? Or are you going to be as bad as some of the ball golf snobs discussed in another thread? Maybe 100 people less than the normal 250 might spectate at this event. Maybe more than normal might watch online hoping for a train wreck. Wouldn't that be something finding out that people would rather watch players of any skill level taking quad circle 12s rather than top pros deucing the bamboo hole?

 

[Cgkdisc]

It's not the USDGC, don't call it the USDGC, and don't get rid of the USDGC that we all love so much.

If one of those big sponsors outside disc golf that he mentioned showed up to write the $25 grand check for developing a new name, I think they would have gone with it.

 

[Scirocco]

Having played in a USDGC, those who play in it will have the best experience ever in an event. It really doesn't matter what you or anyone else thinks who's not playing. Isn't this sport basically about how enjoyable your personal experiences can be whether casual or tournament play and not what anyone else thinks? Or are you going to be as bad as some of the ball golf snobs discussed in another thread? Maybe 100 people less than the normal 250 might spectate at this event. Maybe more than normal might watch online hoping for a train wreck. Wouldn't that be something finding out that people would rather watch players of any skill level taking quad circle 12s rather than top pros deucing the bamboo hole?

I have played it in the past and really enjoyed it. One of the best events of the year.

There might be 100 spectators this year...but when it comes back there on the off-year in two years there won't be anyone watching. Who wants to watch hackers golf? Anyone can do that at their local course. I think your hopes of a large audience seeking a train wreck are grossly optimistic. I mean...who really gives a sh*t about what happens at the USDGC this year? If I am spectating, I want to watch an event full of top-tier golf.

 

[atl scott]

If one of those big sponsors outside disc golf that he mentioned showed up to write the $25 grand check for developing a new name, I think they would have gone with it.

Do you really need a $25k sponsor when there is no payout for the tourney? Trophy only is a lot cheaper than $12k 1st place. I'm assuming they are still selling rocs to help with costs. (edit: just resumed watching at around 18 minutes and JP admits the "lions share" of funding for the tourney comes from rocs and partnership program)

I understand there is some cost involved in changing the name, but I don't think that is justification for calling something new by the same name. Change it and pay the price or don't change it.

 

[Cgkdisc]

It's not your $25K to spend which is in the neighborhood of the cost Innova perceives might be needed to do it the way they've built the USDGC name.

 

[atl scott]

I see what you're saying now, that the cost to change names is $25k. Somehow I thought you were talking about funding the tourney in general. Still doesn't change my original opinion that if you can't afford to do it right why do it? :|

 

[harr0140]

Nice intelligent interview unfortunately it will fall on deaf ears most likely on some people . . . some people just don't understand how decisions are not made solely around their interests. I am not saying who is right or wrong, but JP and Innova have all the right to do what they want with they tourney . . . for better or worse . . . it is their company . . . now in the end they may fall flat on their face with this new venture but it is quite possibly better for their company and at the same time still better for the game, even if it hurts the top pros for this year. Next year maybe someone else will step up and do this sort of thing.

 

[Countchunkula]

I've got my own opinions on the tournament format change. I won't bore anyone with those. I can totally understand the pros frustration of not having the old format. It's a life changer for some players. I don't know for sure but I have a feeling that event helped Nikko partially purchase his Prius and travel this country to pursue his dream.

A couple of things that caught my attention. I've gone thru the not so fun times as well. I worked my butt off rasing my rating to a high of 996. The game started to lose the FUN. I bottomed out this spring and decided to step away from playing local league and tournaments. I've only played 1 event since and i've had a lot more fun playing the game lately.

As a state coordinator, tournament director, volunteer, and tournament player i've seen the ripping of TD's and have experienced it myself. It's not just pros coming into town cutting TD's down. I've seen, heard it, and have read it on disc golf message boards from all skill level players. They complain about anything from payouts to what was served for lunch and anything inbetween. It's sad that people are volunteering their time for US and people do more complaining than helping or saying thank you.

It may not happen but JP could possibly see a total change of his company in the future if some of his wishes come true. The game is still in it's infancy (about 200 years behind golf). Any major company could come in and totally change the structure of this game (rules, equipment, & tournaments). I'm just using Nike but fill any other major name in. They could come in and throw more money at technology and sponsorship than all the current disc companies combined. Just like Wal Mart, Target, Wal Greens, etc... they could run out all the mom and pop shops. They could pay a professional tournament director team to run a specific tour having the largest events and payouts while investing very little in terms of their budget. Nike spends approximately 1.7 BILLION per year in advertising.

I have played a few IOS events over the past couple of years and totally appreciate the work that you guys put in to give us a great experience. There are a lot of players that love IOS tourneys, but haven't taken the time to approach one of you guys and thank them personally.
I guess you have to just realize that you can't please all of the people all of the time. There is always going to be someone bitching, regardless of whether it is the USDGC or a local B tier.

 

[Scirocco]

More or less ALL of the pros are against this change.

No, you can't please all of the people all of the time...but when virtually the ENTIRE FIELD of the best guys are pissed and/or boycotting the event, something has gone awry.

 

[Cgkdisc]

No, you can't please all of the people all of the time...but when virtually the ENTIRE FIELD of the best guys are pissed and/or boycotting the event, something has gone awry.

Someone just told them "the emperors have no clothes." No wonder they're upset with this slap of reality. As JP pointed out, there's no viable financial model that justifies the kind of payouts that have been out there.

 

[Scirocco]

True...but I think that if they lower the payout and and stick to the old, non-handicap format (not the new format that the establishment mouth-pieces swear is all the rage and "better for the sport"), that they would have a much better turnout, both in terms of talent and spectators.

It's not going to be the USDGC anymore. It's a completely different format for an event that favors strategic bagging over skill. Doss said it best (I paraphrase): Thanks, a-holes, for devaluing my world champion creds.

 

[scarpfish]

I boycott the USDGC every year. This year will be no exception.

Of course, being 1,200 miles from Rock Hill and being an 850 rated player probably has more to do with that than a format change.

 

[Cgkdisc]

It's not going to be the USDGC anymore. It's a completely different format for an event that favors strategic bagging over skill.

Strategic bagging is still a skill that no one really knows how to do yet and there are safeguards in place to prevent it. Those who try it will still have to deliver under pressure. Ball golf has done quite well over 50 years with more handicap events each year than we have straight up disc golf PDGA sanctioned events.

 

[Captain Plastic]

The USDGC is dead this year. Who wants to spectate guys that throw
in the mid 900's? That is what I do and it ain't all that pretty. Sometimes I throw
in the upper 800's. All my buddies say the USDGC is for me because I have a low
rating and sometimes I put up a highly rated round. This is funny. Nobody
really wants to spectate that. Think about it? if you had never watched or heard
of this sport and was there for the first time. Wow - what a let down.

It is none of my business why this decision was made. It's hard to not see the pickle
they have put themselves in.

The PDGA should focus on tournaments for the pro players. The frisbee companies have
enough to keep them satisfied. THE PDGA is and should be directed towards bettering
disc golf for profesional players. There will always be an incentive for business to attract
and maintain the "am" base.

 

[Script]

This thread is a good read.

Personally, as a 924 rated player, I see this tourney as a potential great opportunity to experience what the top level guys experience. Think about this though... most players will be Ams. So, for a standard A tier, say the top 10 guys average about 80 bucks of funny money.

Now I've been playing for a long time, so I might be different, but I'd much rather have 4 full days and full rounds devoted to disc golf with the potential to play consistently better than my rating with a chance to take home a trophy. That's just kind of cool to me. I have discs, I'd rather have a week of fun taking off work and having fun on Winthrop's campus.

Now from a pro's standpoint, I can understand. But, I want to ask, if a huge AM only event changed to a full time pro event only, would ams be upset? Yes. However, will the pros be boycotting next years USDGC if top prize is 15k? HELL NO! So, with that said, I don't think I fully understand the Pro argument. The PDGA is trying to replace the potential income every other year with another big tourney, so really, what's the beef?

And chuck made a good point. If pros really want to grow the sport, they would consider showing up. I mean, wouldn't that be one badass tourney if you qualified and next thing you know KC is your flagman on hole 17!?! And that wouldn't grow the sport? Let's give this tourney a chance to succeed before we start complaining about it.

-My 2 cents

 

[lion]

I will not attend and feel that alot wont. If there is money to be made somewhere else that weekend then I expect most will be there.

 

[atl scott]

I want to re-emphasize that this decision (and event) are made by Innova not the PDGA.

 

[Scirocco]

Script...you are the archetype of the talent that does NOT belong at the most prestigious tourney in the sport. I want to watch guys who are good...not lucky.

The pro's main goals aren't to grow the sport...they want to compete on a level playing field of the best golfers in the world. And I want to watch them. $15k every other year is a step backwards from a fat payout every year.

 

[Scirocco]

I want to re-emphasize that this decision (and event) are made by Innova not the PDGA.

You wouldn't know it, what with the PDGA wagons tightly circled and all. Mr. Kennedy doesn't seem to be averse to the idea of a handicap worlds.