? ACE ? Yes or No?

[DiscJunkie]

Definitely an ace. If yall are playing Cali rules then he gets that second shot if he chooses. One of the fun things about being by yourself when playing doubles is you get to take those ace runs.

Playing Cali means you get two shots. An Ace is an Ace whether he got it on the first or second shot. Playing Cali is no advantage. You get two shots, you make your choice. The one you choose counts.
Why all the Ace rules? It's not like it was a mulligan.
If the player throws a shot that will count, it's an Ace.
Why all the special Ace rules??
If the shot goes on a scorecard, it's an ACE!!

 

[Roc1Time]

Its an ace. Cali is a name of the game and if you hit it cali then its all good. It goes on the scorecard and therefore it counts! I have one of these by the way.

 

[CwAlbino]

I see no reason why he wouldn't get the money. If someone hits an ace, there is an ace pot for that person. If there is ever a 1 on any card, someone should be getting the money. You can't just not give out the ace because someone got to throw twice. As for knowing the wind etc etc, personally to me that's bs. If you pay attention to what disc your partner is throwing, and to how he/she is throwing it you can change your mind on what to throw just as well as if you threw it yourself. The same happens in tourneys if you are not first on the card, you watch and pay attention to what the people in front of you throw and decide what to throw based on that. There have been many practice rounds where I throw a few drivers off the tee, 90% of the time my first throw is best if I did not just botch it completely.

I would count it, and I would expect that whoever got the ace 1st or 2nd throw would get the money. You can't pay an invisible partner the ace fund.

 

[scarpfish]

I'm stunned how many people here are saying yes its an ace, and pay the guy out. The local league nearest to me does NOT pay out on a second shot 'ace'. I say no ace, no payout, but for scoring purposes he gets to mark a '1' on the scorecard, just like a paired group would.

Being 'cali' is not necessarily a disadvantage. In fact, if one of the better players in the group is the odd man out, I'd say he has a sizable advantage over the paired players, as he doesn't have to rely on a lesser skilled partner to bail him out of what few mistakes he makes.

To me, the ace pot is a separate issue from the round. If a member of a paired team hit an ace, his partner would not share the money would he? Since all the paired players get only one shot at it per hole, so should the Cali player.

 

[Roc1Time]

To me, the ace pot is a separate issue from the round. If a member of a paired team hit an ace, his partner would not share the money would he? Since all the paired players get only one shot at it per hole, so should the Cali player.

We split the ace pot with our partners. At least every dubs tourney have been to in my 8 years everyone splits

 

[CwAlbino]

I'm stunned how many people here are saying yes its an ace, and pay the guy out. The local league nearest to me does NOT pay out on a second shot 'ace'. I say no ace, no payout, but for scoring purposes he gets to mark a '1' on the scorecard, just like a paired group would.

Being 'cali' is not necessarily a disadvantage. In fact, if one of the better players in the group is the odd man out, I'd say he has a sizable advantage over the paired players, as he doesn't have to rely on a lesser skilled partner to bail him out of what few mistakes he makes.

To me, the ace pot is a separate issue from the round. If a member of a paired team hit an ace, his partner would not share the money would he? Since all the paired players get only one shot at it per hole, so should the Cali player.

I don't know about you but I personally am not going to be making 2 ace runs at the basket. One layup, one ace run. Just like if I had a partner. If an ace is made by one of us, split the money. Wouldn't be fair to not pay your dub partner if all he did that round was layup and didn't even get a chance at ace runs.

 

[ChainMan]

I say if it's a legal try it's an ace and you pay them the full ace pool. I respect your view scarp and it sounds like your local rules/customs are set up that way. I think that's key too and I'll bring it up in our local league to see what they want to do and respect what the group decides.

To me there are advantages to being cali and disadvantages. Some have mentioned the lower pressure of the second shot but I've witnessed and executed horrible second shots so that's a wash to me. Fatigue can be a factor, either mental or physical since you're going to have to throw almost twice as often as any of the other players unless you're tearing it up. Great thread!

 

[John Rock]

Here's the way I see it (and the way we've always done it here):

In a Doubles format each player pays a set entry fee just to get in the event. On top of that (as a side bet) each player pays a set fee to get in the ACE POT (a side bet). During the round each player gets 18 chances at the SIDE BET $$$. It's not fair to let one player (even if that player is the odd man out) get extra throws at the SIDE BET $$$. Sure the odd man out can throw another tee shot as provided by the ODD MAN OUT DOUBLES RULE and try for a 1 on the scorecard, but not to collect the SIDE BET $$$ (which each paying player gets a set number of chances at).

As we have gotten more players here, and several more opportunities to play doubles rounds at different times than the usual Wednesday afternoon Doubles or Second Sunday Doubles, there is a growing sentiment to allow the ODD MAN OUT to pay double for getting into the ACE POT, thus allowing the player double the opportunities to try for the ACE POT. This seems more fair than the other method.

 

[JesusShoes]

well as his 2nd shot is his "partner" i see no problem in him winning the Ace Pot

 

[John Rock]

His "partner" didn't pay anything to get in the ACE POT. If the player paid twice to get in the ACE POT, you have a case for your argument.

 

[scarpfish]

well as his 2nd shot is his "partner" i see no problem in him winning the Ace Pot

Well, by same line of reasoning, if the 2nd shot is his partner, perhaps he should get two throws every shot, instead of just one extra shot per hole.

Who knows, perhaps they do it that way some places.

 

[StymieDidIt]

If I was the Cali player, I'd count the 1, I'd accept the money but I wouldn't put it on my list of aces.

Yeah, all of the above. Technically it would count for everything, but at the personal level. I couldn't feel good about it being a real ace for me. After all, it was the second shot off the tee, Cali or not Last week I hit a 290' shot off the tee at my home course, but I was taking multiple shots to each hole and it was the second shot. The third shot hit off the top off the basket. Just practicing, so even though it was cool, I can't count it as an ace. I don't even know if what I just said makes any sense? I hate when I ramble.

 

[CwAlbino]

His "partner" didn't pay anything to get in the ACE POT. If the player paid twice to get in the ACE POT, you have a case for your argument.

who says his "partner" wasn't the first shot? People are complaining he gets to shoot twice, and that the ace is his "partner", not him. Therefore he doesn't get the payout. Well, what is your reasoning behind it being his "partner's" throw? If he had a partner, then he could have chosen to go second, therefore the second shot would be his, not his "partners". If you want to separate each throw to a different person, then you would have to change the way it is set up. Before each time he tees off, he would have to state whether it's "his" shot or his "partner's" shot. If it were set up this way, then you could charge him twice for ace pool. However, as I see it, charging 1 person twice is just unfair; since he has no say in being alone or with a team member.

edit: actually, i disagree with the charging twice at all. Who is paying the entry fee for that second ace pool fund?

 

[CwAlbino]

Well, by same line of reasoning, if the 2nd shot is his partner, perhaps he should get two throws every shot, instead of just one extra shot per hole.

Who knows, perhaps they do it that way some places.

it's played like doubles... so he would get 2 shots every hole not just on tee-off. he is in essence, filling in for the missing person.

 

[Roc1Time]

I agree with not getting charged twice. Its not like he had that choice

 

[DiscJunkie]

His "partner" didn't pay anything to get in the ACE POT. If the player paid twice to get in the ACE POT, you have a case for your argument.

This is the best reasoning for not paying out, and it makes perfect sense. I'm okay with the no payout, but it's still a great shot and it's an Ace.

 

[zenbot]

Interesting. Everyone calls the lone man Cali. We call him Sven.

 

[John Rock]

Semantics. Just being argumentive trying to get something extra out of it.

Best policy would be to find out ahead of time what the local rule is. If the majority of the group (or the person doing the organizing) says it counts for the $$$, then that's what goes. If that's not to your liking, it's not too difficult to set up your own event and do it how you see fit.

 

[scarpfish]

it's played like doubles... so he would get 2 shots every hole not just on tee-off. he is in essence, filling in for the missing person.

That's a variation called "full Cali". Nothing wrong with it, but its not the way its played competitively in leagues here as the players feel it gives the Cali player too much leverage. Its also apparently not the way they do it where the OP lives.

your playing in a doubles round and theres an odd number of participants so someone has to be the "cali/california/callie", however you wanna call it...turns out the cali is on your card and as the rules go, the cali gets 1 extra throw per hole, drive, approach, putt depending on what they decide....

I think the moral to this story is that doubles is a fun format that you can bake in a lot of different flavors. None of them particularly wrong.

 

[mashnut]

I've seen clubs that pay in this situation, and clubs that don't, and I think it's fine either way as long as the rules are clear before the round starts. I have no issue with someone counting that as an ace, and I would gladly sign their disc after that shot.