Advice on rollers

[Dan Ensor]

I am a FH player and for power rollers I use a Nuke OS, I snap the crap out of it and stand it pretty upright (11 o'clock), since it is so overstable it resists flipping over on to it's head so I can put a lot behind it and it rolls a pretty straight line. As a BH player it will be tougher to roll something like a Nuke OS because you can't invert your release angle as well as you can FH. Something like a Wraith or a Teebird, or a stable Valkyrie are great roller discs for mid-power lever backhand players, IMO. I think its a common misconception that you can only roll flippy discs. Once you get the hang of getting the disc down with power, stable discs will roll longer and straighter.

If I want a roller that turns like a bh, but with an overstable disc, I throw a thumber roller. You can invert the release angle like you say, and the spin is like a bh.

 

[garublador]

I'm far from an expert on rollers, but what do people think about his 11 o'clock landing angle? It seems a bit too upright from my experience. I'd try experimenting with that as it's something you can easily control. People telling you to throw with more speed or spin (I have the same view as Dave D. when it comes to spin) are really just saying that you need to throw it better, which isn't horribly helpful.

It seems as if what angle the disc hits the ground and how hard it hits the ground are the big things to control with rollers. A disc landing gently performs differently than a disc slamming into the ground.

Edit: I got distracted while writing this so it looks like Jax11 ninja'd my points.

 

[Jax11]

If I want a roller that turns like a bh, but with an overstable disc, I throw a thumber roller. You can invert the release angle like you say, and the spin is like a bh.

That's a great idea, I may have to try this some time.

 

[sneakytiki]

Yes.

I understand why you'd say that, but I think you're missing something. True: there's more mass along a disc's rim than in the center... any golf disc - drivers, mids, putters. But the wider and sharper the rim is, the closer the mass is to the axis of rotation (i.e. the center of the disc).

Putters have more mass along the outer edge of the rim than mids.
Mids have more mass along the edge than Drivers, etc.

In drivers, the rim is significantly thinner at the edge (less mass at the furthest radius) and thicker at the innermost point of the rim (closer to the center). Putters tend to concentrate all the mass (other than the mass contained in the flightplate) about as far from the center as possible - hence they spin slower than drivers.

If you really wanted to move more mass toward the center to increase spin, just make the flighplate thicker than the wing. Think of a pancake that's thick in the middle, and razor thin at the edge. That would put the more mass at the center... but likely kills aerodynamics (particularly lift and glide).

Wide rimmed distance drivers are the closest to that design concept, but most of the middle has been "hollowed out" to provide a wing so that air passes faster over the top than the bottom to create lift.

Does that help?

It does. I never really put as much consideration to the sharpness of the angle of the disc edge moving weight towards the center, but you are right. I have always thought more of the thinning of the flight plate and moving that mass to the rim. If you were to take discs with equal edge angles into account however, those with thicker rims would have more weight around the outside, as the only place for the weight to come from is the flight plate.

 

[Dan Ensor]

This disc clock isn't making sense to me. Is 9 and 3 landing flat? Or is 6 landing flat on either side?


If 9 and 3 are flat, 10:30 or less bites and cut rolls bad on me.

 

[JonCatch]

Did someone say Disc Clock?

 

[chrishysell]

I throw forehand rollers with different stability Surges. My backhand rollers are Nukes and Ti Nuke SS's.

 

[Jax11]

This disc clock isn't making sense to me. Is 9 and 3 landing flat? Or is 6 landing flat on either side?


If 9 and 3 are flat, 10:30 or less bites and cut rolls bad on me.

For me 9 and 3 are flat, 12 and 6 are directly up an down.

If you throw something stable and hard at 10:00 it will bite and cut roll, if the disc is really flippy it will turn up to straight and eventually fall on its head. It will kind of roll an "S" patten.

 

[Jax11]

For me 9 and 3 are flat, 12 and 6 are directly up an down.

If you throw something stable and hard at 10:00 it will bite and cut roll, if the disc is really flippy it will turn up to straight and eventually fall on its head. It will kind of roll an "S" patten.

Sorry for the double post, but I thought of a nice way to think about what I am talking about. If you think of rollers as a two part shot, first part being from the throwers hand right up to the point it contacts the ground, part 2 is when the discs make contact with the ground to when it stops rolling.

Part 2 mimics the flight of an air shot turned 90 degrees clockwise from the perspective of a RHBH thrower. A flippy disc can go from 10 o clock and stand up to 12 and eventually flip over on its head, just like a flippy disc can be hyzer flipped to a turnover shot. A stable disc that hits at 10 o clock will cut roll and hold that line just like a stable disc will hold a hyzer line on an air shot.

Is this making sense? Its difficult to explain through text.:\

 

[Dan Ensor]

It makes sense. I don't throw much flippy stuff; I usually roll with nukes and forces; I didn't think about how much lower a flippy disc could flip up from.

 

[knettles]

It does. I never really put as much consideration to the sharpness of the angle of the disc edge moving weight towards the center, but you are right. I have always thought more of the thinning of the flight plate and moving that mass to the rim. If you were to take discs with equal edge angles into account however, those with thicker rims would have more weight around the outside, as the only place for the weight to come from is the flight plate.

No, sneakytiki, you were right to begin with. Wider rimmed discs do have more mass towards the outer edge of the discs. Ask a pro or someone that makes discs, they'll tell you. That's why wider rimmed discs are harder to get up to speed, because of the difference in inertia. That's also one reason why putters are much more susceptible to OAT than drivers. With more weight towards the center of the disc, they have less gyroscopic effect to keep them on the same axis of rotation.

 

[jmw1121d1]

Not my thread but I did want to say thanks to all the Roller contributors. A lot of good info. Playing mostly in the woods I only use rollers in desperate spots and usually the results are worse than betting against the house in Vegas. Too many roots, sticks, ditches, holes, bushes, trees, etc...... A couple places on a few local course where (in grassy areas) I have thought about sky rollers and longer rollers, but really didn't know what to practice. This thread gave me some ideas to practice so thanks guys.