Boycott the USDGC?

[#19325]

I would like to know how much the Ford Explorer into the pond with Mary Jane weighed into the decision. Seemed like a knee jerk reaction last fall.

 

[vonDrehle]

I want to re-emphasize that this decision (and event) are made by Innova not the PDGA.

But like I said before it is still listed as a Major by the PDGA. Personally if something is going to be labeled one of the biggest tournaments of the year by the governing body of the sport than there should be some sort of standard/regulation.

To compare to ball golf you don't see guys that shoot 85+ on a regular course in the US Open. That would take away from the professionals that have played the tournament in the past and the winner that year, though not literally, would have an * by their name when people thought of them.

 

[Cgkdisc]

Reality check. My guess is first place doesn't top $10K in 2012.

 

[Scirocco]

What's your point, Chuck?

 

[Cgkdisc]

You wouldn't know it, what with the PDGA wagons tightly circled and all. Mr. Kennedy doesn't seem to be averse to the idea of a handicap worlds.

You would be wrong. The fundamental reason we have ratings versus handicaps is I persuaded PDGA Commissioner Jim Challas in 1998 that players would rather play against others of similar skill level (measured by ratings) with straight up scores rather than use adjusted scores like ball golf handicaps. Was I right?

 

[Cgkdisc]

I believe big payouts will dwindle. Until the number of eyeballs increases, increasing sponsor money won't be there. Disc golf manufacturers are already adjusting downward based on their more limited cash sponsorships in big events. The USDGC is just a higher profile example.

 

[Spatula Cornroll]

Mr. Kennedy doesn't seem to be averse to the idea of a handicap worlds.

How are they going to get all the wheelchairs around the course?

 

[Scirocco]

You would be wrong. The fundamental reason we have ratings versus handicaps is I persuaded PDGA Commissioner Jim Challas in 1998 that players would rather play against others of similar skill level (measured by ratings) with straight up scores rather than use adjusted scores like ball golf handicaps. Was I right?

You were, as evidenced by this year's boycott.

But this change...Wow. Innova must really have the PDGA by the balls...even more than I previously thought.

 

[DiscJunkie]

I understand that JP is trying something new to grow the sport and he estimates that AMs are the best pool for growth.
Next, I understand and have heard from other sources that Innova folks are somewhat dis-illusioned by the bitterness of the travelling pros.
That being said, both parties (Innova and the Pros) have legitimate gripes. However, the "Golden Rule" (He that has the gold makes the rules) comes into play here. Innova has the right to decide how they spend their money.
They feel like they are "investing" in the AMs, instead of the pros.
We'll just have to wait and see how it plays out.

 

[turbosteve]

In the past the USDGC has been funded in part from money from the South Carolina tourism board. The state of South Carolina has had budget cuts the last cpl of years. I am wondering if the South Carolina tourism board's budget was cut and if they may have reduced their funding to the tournament.

 

[Scirocco]

How are they going to get all the wheelchairs around the course?

I would have the "volunteers" (who were required to pay $60 for the high honor this year at pro worlds) push them around. :hfive:

 

[Cgkdisc]

The PDGA has always been arms length with the USDGC since it's not the PDGA U.S. Championship but the USDGC presented by Innova. Even this year, it's the PDGA Championship without U.S. in the name.

 

[DiscJunkie]

Let me also say that I'm disappointed about this decision.
I live in NC, so it was a big deal to travel to Rock Hill every year and spend the weekend watching the game's best players. The group has decided not to go this year.

I also sympathize with the travelling pros who counted on the USDGC payouts every year. The USDGC paid out, I think, at least $1000 to the top 20. There are VERY FEW tourneys that pay $1000 for WINNING, much less 20th. Talk about pulling the rug out from these guys.

We'll just have to wait and see if Innova's strategy works.

 

[Script]

Scirocco, I hate your attitude. As a 924 player, it's gonna take a whole hell of a lot to qualify for this thing. I'm gonna probably have to put together a tourney of 970 golf. So, if I get in, I'll feel proud as hell making it. If pro's don't want to help grow the sport, then they will perpetually give themselves a very crappy quality of life. If they sacrifice a tourney a year and try to be more involved, then maybe that 10k paycheck will be 70k in several years.

So which do you want? 10k now, or potentially a lot more in the years to come?

And Scirocco, I know your hung up on am's shouldn't be playing the USDGCs, but it's been decided, so why shouldn't I be looking forward to this? What was Will's final score last year? 28 under under over 4 rounds? So, that's 7 under a round. So, even if I'm given 7 strokes a round, I'd have to shoot even par. That would be the round of my life. And I'd have to do that 4 rounds in a row. I would deserve it!

Also, only 68 of 185 pro's even cashed at last years event. I know pros think they are awesome, but most likely 90% of the pros who played the USDGC did not do so because they knew they would cash. So are only 10% of pros not coming for the USDGCs?

 

[turbosteve]

As a Rock Hill native I am disappointed in this change because it won't attract the same level of spectators as it has in previous years. The format change is going to put a ding in the roughly $1 million dollars that the tournament contributes to the local economy.

 

[The Bard]

Because apparently no one else wanted to do it.

Yes, the biggest reason is about money no doubt about that. Followed second by growing the sport in general. Even though he said "it's not a money making venture" (see the YouTube video), it still is about money because he spent a lot of time basically saying "this event causes us to lose a bunch of money".

It is a company and they have the right to do what they want. Does it diminish the USDGC prestige, yes. Will this be good for the sport in the long run? Maybe, we'll have to see.

It really is unfortunate to see money get in the way of sports as we are used to like in football and now recently basketball.

Throughout the first half of the video I was frustrated, but by the end I was really refreshed. I appreciated the realness with which he spoke about the state of the sport and I believe painted a good picture of the sport as a whole. He is trying to look out for the sport as a whole. Will this flop? Maybe. I also appreciated the frankness with which he spoke about TDs experiences and the challenge top pros face. I also really appreciate that he puts his family first.

Will this end up being a good thing? Only time will tell. These debates rage whenever a major change happens in sports. Whatever happens, in 10 years I'll bet this won't be a huge topic of discussion. People will get more familiar with it and it will become the norm. Just look at tons of sports major changes example. I'm sure adding the 3-point line and adding the Masters as a major in golf in 1934 just as a couple of examples created a lot of stir. Now we appreciate them. Am I saying this will happen with the USDGC? No. Just simply saying that major changes cause controversy and are easily forgotten about just a few years later.

 

[DiscJunkie]

As a Rock Hill native I am disappointed in this change because it won't attract the same level of spectators as it has in previous years. The format change is going to put a ding in the roughly $1 million dollars that the tournament contributes to the local economy.

My hope for Rock Hill is that more family will travel with the AM competitors, so it won't be a big change.

If it is a big drop, maybe that will be a proving point for "destination tourneys" like the USDGC getting more sponsorship from the Chambers of Commerce and local municipalities.

 

[Cgkdisc]

We'll just have to wait and see if Innova's strategy works.

The strategy going forward should be pretty simple to observe. Innova is a business and the old USDGC model was financially broken. I would expect nothing more or less than a businesslike approach where future events have reasonable financial underpinnings, not necessarily profitable but less of a loss than 2010 and earlier.

 

[Captain Plastic]

I have traveled to Rock Hill to spectate the USDGC.
People from my town have done the same. Not this year.
It's not even on the table. Can't stress enough that 950 golf at
Winthrop is painful to watch. It's such a big stage. Fun as hell to play
950 golf. I am always proud when I do but there is just no wow factor
to it. Knowing that there are guys averaging 1040 is wow factor.

Glad the players playing are excited. I just don't really have any interest
in the end result. You are not the best. I wish you the best but time is precious.
I don't watch amateur sports. Who does?

 

[jsun3thousand]

from 17:46 on is really worth watching. there is just a gap between the top touring pros and the reality of disc golf's financial situation.