Climo wanted to call a penalty for this?

[Rastnav]

Don't think this belongs in the rules forum, as I'm really more interested in a conversation about overall DG culture.

During the GK Pro Skins at Waco, Cale Leiviska told a story about how Nikko backed him up when he hit a lengthy putt to tie the tournament at the 2007 Majestic and apparently Climo had issue with it, specifically Cale spiking his putter in celebration after clearing the basket.

I'm having trouble imagining something like that happening today, and I'm just wondering what has changed between now and then.

Here (I believe) is the putt:


Here is the story:

 

[thechamp]

That's a lot of crowd noise for a few dozen spectators...

 

[thethrill]

Disc golf was more cut throat back in the day. Things could get heated very fast and emotions soared. Now days it seems most players are unwilling to make a call because it brings "bad vibes" to the card and probably why Nikko got away with so much foolery.

 

[foxdawg10]

Climo has made his fair share of questionable calls in his day. Ask Scott Stokley.

 

[elmexdela]

cale cant design a quality course to save his life but damm can he play/throw

love that old video

 

[seedlings]

For professional tournaments, I'm all for a more cutthroat disc golf game! But in more of an MMA style, where during the match, no holds barred, and after the match hugs and grace. I'm not a fan of hugs and grace during pro tournaments.

 

[DanJon]

It seems like Climo wasn't that well liked as a person when he was touring.

Respected, yes, but the stories seem to paint the picture of a rough dude.

 

[zenbot]

Don't even wander into BattleBots forums. The last episode got people really riled up.

 

[nothinbuttree]

Disc golf was more cut throat back in the day. Things could get heated very fast and emotions soared. Now days it seems most players are unwilling to make a call because it brings "bad vibes" to the card and probably why Nikko got away with so much foolery.

Which is more interesting considering prizes were mostly in the 3 digit range, and the player pool was much smaller with many players crashing together under the same roof on the road.

 

[txmxer]

It's about competitiveness. I'd say calling that was chickensh!t, but there are some people for whom not losing is the prime directive.

And I'd say the round was over so spiking the disc could not be a practice throw or whatever complaint was given.

 

[jenb]

It's about competitiveness. I'd say calling that was chickensh!t, but there are some people for whom not losing is the prime directive.

And I'd say the round was over so spiking the disc could not be a practice throw or whatever complaint was given.

Yeah I recall when this happened and that was the ruling iirc. His round was over when he holed out on the last hole. I think Ken thought his round should be over when the card was turned in. Kinda makes sense cause if your round is over, does that mean you can strip your shirt off and chug a beer while taunting competitors as they are still trying to hole out?

 

[Moose33]

There are a lot of stories about KC either giving some questionable calls or shaking off one on him. I can't remember when, maybe an old Smashboxx episode where Jerm talked about calling him for a foot fault that was pretty funny.

 

[Ryan P.]

KC was definitely Nikko-ish when it came to calling stuff. Yes, that was partially because everything was more cut throat back then, but also because rules were more enforced and that particular rule was enforced. I remember people giving me a warning because I had two discs in hand, dropped the one I didn't want to throw, and it rolled away. I'm not sure if they gave me an official warning or just said "hey I can call you on that be careful" but either way it shows how much more strict it was.

This past weekend at Waco someone was throwing their disc up in the air 5-10 feet and catching it while they were waiting to throw. I think it was Kevin Jones. No one cared.

 

[Rastnav]

Yeah I recall when this happened and that was the ruling iirc. His round was over when he holed out on the last hole. I think Ken thought his round should be over when the card was turned in. Kinda makes sense cause if your round is over, does that mean you can strip your shirt off and chug a beer while taunting competitors as they are still trying to hole out?

I'm curious what you you remember the attempted call being? Something like unsporting conduct? Or was the practice throw rule way more strict back then?

 

[BuiltTooLong]

KC was definitely Nikko-ish when it came to calling stuff. Yes, that was partially because everything was more cut throat back then, but also because rules were more enforced and that particular rule was enforced. I remember people giving me a warning because I had two discs in hand, dropped the one I didn't want to throw, and it rolled away. I'm not sure if they gave me an official warning or just said "hey I can call you on that be careful" but either way it shows how much more strict it was.

This past weekend at Waco someone was throwing their disc up in the air 5-10 feet and catching it while they were waiting to throw. I think it was Kevin Jones. No one cared.

This rule has changed. It used to be less than 2 meters and has changed to 5.

809.03 Practice Throw
A practice throw is any throw that is not made as a competitive attempt to change the lie, except for a throw that is made either to set aside an unused disc or to return a disc to a player and that travels less than five meters in the air. A drop is not a practice throw.
A player receives one penalty throw for making a practice throw; the throw itself is disregarded and not counted.

 

[Rastnav]

This past weekend at Waco someone was throwing their disc up in the air 5-10 feet and catching it while they were waiting to throw. I think it was Kevin Jones. No one cared.

I'd argue that's not a practice throw, as you are attempting to get the disc to return to the position it starts at, rather than change its position. Of course you can nitpick about "change" and "position", but I'd read that in the context of what a lie is.

But, yeah, nitpicking would be a product of cutthroat competition, so point taken.

 

[Rastnav]

This rule has changed. It used to be less than 2 meters and has changed to 5.

809.03 Practice Throw
A practice throw is any throw that is not made as a competitive attempt to change the lie, except for a throw that is made either to set aside an unused disc or to return a disc to a player and that travels less than five meters in the air. A drop is not a practice throw.
A player receives one penalty throw for making a practice throw; the throw itself is disregarded and not counted.

The 5m only applies to attempt to set aside a disc or return a disc to "a player" (presumably some other player). You can't, for instance, practice putt from 3 meter during the round, I don't believe.

Although, I suppose one could argue you are attempting to return it to yourself by throwing it in the air.

 

[biscoe]

Climo was so competitive it was ridiculous. Feldberg once told me a story about how hardcore he was on winning at penny ante poker.

 

[Steve West]

The 5m only applies to attempt to set aside a disc or return a disc to "a player" (presumably some other player). You can't, for instance, practice putt from 3 meter during the round, I don't believe.

Although, I suppose one could argue you are attempting to return it to yourself by throwing it in the air.

When the rules only apply to another player, they say "another player". When the rules say "a player" or "any player" that includes the thrower.

And, yes, tossing a disc up to catch it is returning it to yourself. Just don't toss it more than 2.5 meters up, because 2.5 meters up plus 2.5 meters down is 5 meters in the air. That would be a practice throw.

 

[Cgkdisc]

In the OP Cale situation, as I understand it (I was there but didn't directly hear this), Climo didn't call Cale on a practice throw violation but simply asked someone if it was a practice throw. But his act of asking was eventually restated as him calling it out like a referee.