I like my courses to be wooded like the courses of Northern Wisconsin!!! it is interesting tho to see how the terms Lightly, moderate and heavily wooded get used as you travel from region to region.
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How wooded do we like it?
- Thread starter Dave242
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I was thinking about this. What people consider heavly wooded varies quite a bit depending on where you are, as well as peoples opinions of what constitutes very hilly.
My idea of havily wooded courses is when you can play the course in heavy rain on a winter day and not get wet.
KniceZ
Double Eagle Member
How much elevation change does it take to get rated very hilly? Are the courses in GA really VERY Hilly??? I would think the folks out west would laugh at that.
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You never said anything about the effective length in your first post which makes that statement a little more sound, but I still ain't buying what you selling. How do you factor in rolling elevation that nets a zero elevation change? Or elevation as an obstacle to the side/s of the hole?
Cgkdisc
.:Hall of Fame Member:.
Members of the DGCD designers group use a Hole Forecaster that can forecast the scoring average of a hole for each skill level before it's thrown. From data over the past 10 years, we've checked it out and that's what we've found regarding elevation adjustments within the precision available. No impact with rolling hills. Just the difference in elevation between tee and pin. Rolling hills are just more interesting and fun than a level shot.
We have additional adjustments in there I didn't mention. For example, if a lower skill level does not have the average distance to throw across a valley, they will effectively have a longer hole because they'll be throwing up the hill on their second shot compared with the higher skill level players that can clear it.
Note we're only talking about figuring out the effective length of a hole, not adjusting for other factors like precarious pins on mounds or sidehills. Those can be tougher due to elevation but doesn't come into play to determine the effective length of a hole.
We have additional adjustments in there I didn't mention. For example, if a lower skill level does not have the average distance to throw across a valley, they will effectively have a longer hole because they'll be throwing up the hill on their second shot compared with the higher skill level players that can clear it.
Note we're only talking about figuring out the effective length of a hole, not adjusting for other factors like precarious pins on mounds or sidehills. Those can be tougher due to elevation but doesn't come into play to determine the effective length of a hole.
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Sadjo
* Ace Member *
North Georgia...the top 3rd of the state is considered foothills of the Smoky Mountains and extreme Northeast Georgia is in the mountains. Might not be as high elevation wise as places out west but when you compare North Georgia to, let's say, Indiana or Kansas, then yes, Georgia has plenty of courses you can consider hilly.
Check out the cover photo of the 2011 Innova Calendar or the November 2013 Innova Calendar. Those pictures are of Chattooga Belle Farm in SC. The mountains in the pictures are in Georgia....that course is on the stateline. I'd consider that to be a hilly course.
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Just to play Devils Advocate: I bet this wouldn't hold true if you designed a course with significant elevation, and all of the elevation change played either either up or down hill...but not both. Strange as it seems, it's quite possible possible.
Say you had a very hilly piece of land, and were able to layout 9 out of 18 holes with significant downhill slopes - the kind that really add some distance to your tee shots. The other 9 holes net out to zero elevation change (or close enough to it). How can you always seem to be throwing downhill without ever throwing uphill? Simple: the course was designed so that the walk from basket to next tee goes uphill, and you throw downhill. While there's no net elevation change walking the entire course, you don't play the entire path you walk.
Hence, a course can play with a significant net elevation change. Wouldn't that have to affect SSA's, or did I miss something?
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Cgkdisc
.:Hall of Fame Member:.
You simply calculate the elevation difference on each hole and add them up. One of the courses I have lots of quality stats on is Granite Ridge at Highbridge. Even though it starts and ends at the top of the hill, there are 11 downhill holes, 4 uphill and 3 essentially level. That's because several holes have uphill walks from the pin to the next tee as you suggest.
TheWCG
* Ace Member *
I'm a big fan of granite ridge. I've played it once and the amount of downhill shots were the best I've seen.:thmbup:
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To Mashnut's point (lifted from a different thread about Selah Ranch):
StuMagoo and Martin see things a bit differently. The difference is that Stu's played 53 courses: a decent amount, (and certainly more than quite a few folks), but all in Texas. That's his "DG frame of reference." I wouldn't doubt Selahs courses are moderatlely hilly, for Texas.
But having played tons of courses in essentially every (and not just a couple in each state, but many courses in pretty much each state) Martin probably has very little (if any) "regional" bias. His concept of wooded/open, hilly/flat is based on "DG frame of reference" most of us can't even dream of. Wouldn't surprise me if every course he's played in Texas seems flat.
No offense intended toward StuMagoo (or anyone else for that matter). This just seemed like a perfect example to illustrate how regional bias can affect what we read.
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thx!
that's gotta help peg the fun-o-meter, which is likely a major contributing factor towards it being listed in the top 10.
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Yeah yeah yeah.....CO has a reputation of overrating things around here.
On a more on topic note, you do not need big mountains to make it very hilly. If say 9 holes have elevation of 20'+ and another 3-5 have have elevation of 10-20', that is a very hilly course in the scheme of things (in the top 1/3 of hilliness).
On a more on topic note, you do not need big mountains to make it very hilly. If say 9 holes have elevation of 20'+ and another 3-5 have have elevation of 10-20', that is a very hilly course in the scheme of things (in the top 1/3 of hilliness).
Sadjo
* Ace Member *
I played the AM world in Fort Collins CO in 1993 and don't recall those courses being very hilly. Even Grandma Millers Farm Course up at 10-thousand feet elevation had more flat holes than holes that played up or down hill.
quite often those mountain courses don't play as well as courses that utilize "hills"
I am the only disc golfer in the world who doesnt get excited about mountain golf
I am the only disc golfer in the world who doesnt get excited about mountain golf
I was gonna say I'd take the rolling hills of Kentucky over some big boring mountain anyday
Ft collins isn't exactly hills, much less mountains. I was thinking either Beaver or Bailey.. or Leadville as mountain courses.
I was just poking fun at the "Mountains" back east since I live higher than any place east of the Mississippi. I've hiked some brutal hills with serious steep elevation gains in Michigan, but your mountains back there aren't very tall, or very rugged. They are older than the Rockies, more like our foothills.
I was just poking fun at the "Mountains" back east since I live higher than any place east of the Mississippi. I've hiked some brutal hills with serious steep elevation gains in Michigan, but your mountains back there aren't very tall, or very rugged. They are older than the Rockies, more like our foothills.
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