Knee discomfort

[Fronkjd]

About two weeks ago in the field I tweaked my plant leg. The initial pain was felt on inside of the leg slightly above the knee at that distinct tendon or muscle you can feel with your hand.

I took a week off and went to throw again yesterday and it flared up again. Now I'm feeling it a little more on the front of the knee below my knee cap and it just feels slightly tense and puffy, but not painful or physically different. Has anybody else dealt with something similiar? I'm assuming my follow through and rotation has gone awry and I'm putting unnecessary stress on my knee.

I've been playing for a year now and have never had any knee pain or discomfort while playing. I have no recent footage, sorry.

 

[Moose33]

Sounds like you either tweaked your LCL or the bottom part of your quad/groin muscle. It has happened to me when I was on a surface that made it difficult for my front knee to rotate.

If it's not better with rest and ice, you could have a tear. The smaller ligaments(or large ones if there is any previous damage) don't always have a pop or single big moment of pain.

I'd keep an eye on it and see a physician if it doesn't get better.

 

[ru4por]

Swelling usually indicates injury. When I injure myself, I generally seek medical advice from a medical professional. Not that we sages, here in the annuls of DGCR, cannot play medical professionals on TV, but I think you should have your knee looked at, if it is not getting any better.

 

[DavidSauls]

Swelling usually indicates injury. When I injure myself, I generally seek medical advice from a medical professional. Not that we sages, here in the annuls of DGCR, cannot play medical professionals on TV, but I think you should have your knee looked at, if it is not getting any better.

An orthopedic surgeon once told me, after initial examination, "Sooner or later you'll come to me to fix it."

Yeah, rest may heal it, but if it doesn't, find someone who actually knows what they're talking about. I may be ahead of most in this room, with 2 knee surgeries and enduring a torn meniscus right now, but the only really relevant experience I can offer is that, knees are hard to self-diagnose and even harder to self-treat.

 

[Riverdog]

Ahhhh phttttt.... given enough time even a monkey could fix a knee. [emoji23][emoji23][emoji23][emoji23]


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[ChrisWoj]

About two weeks ago in the field I tweaked my plant leg. The initial pain was felt on inside of the leg slightly above the knee at that distinct tendon or muscle you can feel with your hand.

I took a week off and went to throw again yesterday and it flared up again. Now I'm feeling it a little more on the front of the knee below my knee cap and it just feels slightly tense and puffy, but not painful or physically different. Has anybody else dealt with something similiar? I'm assuming my follow through and rotation has gone awry and I'm putting unnecessary stress on my knee.

I've been playing for a year now and have never had any knee pain or discomfort while playing. I have no recent footage, sorry.

As others have said: seek a medical professional if you want any real diagnosis.

My advice: Do. Not. ****. With. It. You **** up your knee, it won't be the same. Based on the videos you've posted - you're still a kid with a ton of years of competition in front of you. You don't want to carry this injury with you through that. If you rest, though, that youth will benefit you in the form of a really nice and relatively swift recovery.

The acronym I like to hold to is ARITA: Active Recovery Is The Answer.

What this means is doing nothing that causes the injured tissue to hurt. But doing enough that you're engaging the overall knee in activity. You want the knee to recover in such a way that it is stronger than it was before all the way around. The injured connective tissues are given a chance to heal, and the rest of the tissues and muscles are worked to strengthen in support of that injured tissue. I'm a big fan of careful asana yoga for this - look for gentle routines that'll engage you in balance and careful strengthening movement and avoid engaging any poses that even begin to make it feel tweaky.

Additionally - if you do not need to put any serious strain on the knee and can avoid strenuous activity you should stay away from ibuprofen (advil, motrin, etc.) and icing. Those are both good for when you'll need to go through strenuous activity, they limit swelling and stressing swollen tissues can result in further tissue damage... BUT if you won't be doing something that is strenuous you'd rather have swelling because the swelling is indicative of an active recovery. Limiting swelling means limiting the quality of the healing, resulting in long term reduction in pliability of the tissue.

I highly recommend seeing a physical therapist if you have insurance. A therapist could guide you specifically toward recovery activities that would be safest for your condition.

 

[txmxer]

An orthopedic surgeon once told me, after initial examination, "Sooner or later you'll come to me to fix it."

Yeah, rest may heal it, but if it doesn't, find someone who actually knows what they're talking about. I may be ahead of most in this room, with 2 knee surgeries and enduring a torn meniscus right now, but the only really relevant experience I can offer is that, knees are hard to self-diagnose and even harder to self-treat.

RICE (Rest-Ice-Compression-Elevation) are great first steps. Don't leave out the elevation.

See a doctor...probably get a referral to a PT if there no specific structural damage--if you don't get a referral, you might ask for one. Common knee problems that don't involve specific damage are often related to "muscle amnesia". PT can help you with that. Some related/background info on the subject.

https://www.military.com/military-fitness/health/strengthen-glute-medius-to-avoid-common-knee-pain

https://essentialsomatics.com/clinical-somatics-articles-case-studies/got-pain-maybe-its-sensory-motor-amnesia

 

[ChrisWoj]

RICE (Rest-Ice-Compression-Elevation) are great first steps. Don't leave out the elevation.

Ice causes cellular damage and reduces long term pliability in recovered tissues. If one can avoid putting excess stress on the tissues, one should never ice. Ice is only useful for when excess stress on the tissue is unavoidable, as excess stress on an already swollen joint can cause excess time spent swollen resulting in edema and chronic swelling. But if the excess stress can be avoided, do not ice at all. Let the body's natural processes result in swelling and natural use and clearance of fluids involved in the healing process.

RICE, as an acronym, is designed around getting one back to competition/work as quickly as possible. It is not designed around maximizing long term recovery.

 

[ru4por]

Ice causes cellular damage and reduces long term pliability in recovered tissues. If one can avoid putting excess stress on the tissues, one should never ice. Ice is only useful for when excess stress on the tissue is unavoidable, as excess stress on an already swollen joint can cause excess time spent swollen resulting in edema and chronic swelling. But if the excess stress can be avoided, do not ice at all. Let the body's natural processes result in swelling and natural use and clearance of fluids involved in the healing process.

RICE, as an acronym, is designed around getting one back to competition/work as quickly as possible. It is not designed around maximizing long term recovery.

This is important information. Inflammation is the bodies natural response to injury, kind of like a fever to infection. Stifling the bodies natural response, is not the right action for recovery. There are some exceptions to this, but it is a solid rule of thumb for most injury.

 

[txmxer]

Ice causes cellular damage and reduces long term pliability in recovered tissues. If one can avoid putting excess stress on the tissues, one should never ice. Ice is only useful for when excess stress on the tissue is unavoidable, as excess stress on an already swollen joint can cause excess time spent swollen resulting in edema and chronic swelling. But if the excess stress can be avoided, do not ice at all. Let the body's natural processes result in swelling and natural use and clearance of fluids involved in the healing process.

RICE, as an acronym, is designed around getting one back to competition/work as quickly as possible. It is not designed around maximizing long term recovery.

Thanks for the input/information. Not in any way to contradict or argue, but would appreciate some additional insight.

I've dealt with injuries going back to the 80's and of course treatment has evolved a lot. (Five knee surgeries, one shoulder rebuild in 2003). Many of the PT sessions I've done in recovery involved post session icing.

My questions:

Is the idea of allowing acute inflammation to proceed naturally relatively new? Meaning the last 10 years or so? Is it common today? Do Dr's and PT's recognize the need to allow the inflammation to run its natural course?

What about compression and elevation? They are generally used to reduce swelling, but would that be an issue?

Rabbit hole...

I don't intend to offer medical advice--only experience. And that experience leads me to recommend seeing professionals. OTOH, as a layperson, it is important to have as much knowledge as possible on the subject or simply place your trust in the medical professional. But, not all medical professionals are created equal. And then there is the evolution of the internet and countless people that are ultimately trying to make money with the best vitamin supplement or routine (subscribe to my channel. Become a premium member of my website. Buy my book. Elongate your T-cells and live forever. Drink alkaline water. etc.) It is very difficult to sort fact from fiction.

Leads me to short story. I went to Wal-Mart pharmacy to get syringes for my diabetic cat. I couldn't remember offhand the specific size, and the young lady working the counter asked me if they were for testosterone therapy--which implies to me that that is becoming extremely common. I asked my doctor about it once and he was not enthusiastic, lol.

Fortunately, we did get the right syringes for the cat.

Sorry for the rabbit hole. Hope I don't derail the thread.

 

[DiscFifty]

This game has a physical addiction I think most players suffer from, it's a very tactile feedback sport. It's hard to just stop playing.

If I could go back a few months I should have just stopped playing after my recent injury. It's taken me a long time to heal from strained knee tendons. This could be what the op is suffering from. There's little blood flow in the knees so things take longer to heal. Turned out soft tissue massage has helped dramatically along with with rest and massive stretching. Stop playing, see a doc, save your knee.

 

[ChrisWoj]

Thanks for the input/information. Not in any way to contradict or argue, but would appreciate some additional insight.

I've dealt with injuries going back to the 80's and of course treatment has evolved a lot. (Five knee surgeries, one shoulder rebuild in 2003). Many of the PT sessions I've done in recovery involved post session icing.

My questions:

Is the idea of allowing acute inflammation to proceed naturally relatively new? Meaning the last 10 years or so? Is it common today? Do Dr's and PT's recognize the need to allow the inflammation to run its natural course?

What about compression and elevation? They are generally used to reduce swelling, but would that be an issue?

As you asked for who recognizes this advice, I'll go with Dr. Gabe Mirkin who literally wrote the book that popularized R.I.C.E. in 1978:
https://www.drmirkin.com/fitness/why-ice-delays-recovery.html

I don't intend to offer medical advice--only experience. And that experience leads me to recommend seeing professionals. OTOH, as a layperson, it is important to have as much knowledge as possible on the subject or simply place your trust in the medical professional. But, not all medical professionals are created equal. And then there is the evolution of the internet and countless people that are ultimately trying to make money with the best vitamin supplement or routine (subscribe to my channel. Become a premium member of my website. Buy my book. Elongate your T-cells and live forever. Drink alkaline water. etc.) It is very difficult to sort fact from fiction.

I'd say I'm probably about two years behind on any state-of-the-field training and recovery information right now. I've been a distance runner my whole life, and 2014-2018 was a distance running coach for a high school program. I also spent 2014-2017 as a high school anatomy and physiology teacher, and most of my student groups were heavy on the school's athletes so I tended to take a lot of time to find good recent medical literature that applied to athletics because they really took to the lessons if I could focus them on the physiology of athletic training (physiological lessons on pregnancy, cancer, recreational drugs, and athletic performance were the topics that really engaged them). But yeah... its now been a couple of years since I shifted focus.

 

[scooby snack]

There are two types of inflammation..

Acute inflammation, which is your body's way of protecting itself.
Chronic inflammation, which is bad for you.

 

[txmxer]

There are two types of inflammation..

Acute inflammation, which is your body's way of protecting itself.
Chronic inflammation, which is bad for you.

True, but chronic inflammation is frequently a symptom of something much worse.

 

[txmxer]

I've often thought if I knew now what I knew then, I could have circumvented a lot of the issues I developed over the years. Balanced muscle training and proper kinetic sequences for things like running/jogging. Sounds like you provided that for your student athletes. I hope that is more common these days.

 

[ChrisWoj]

I've often thought if I knew now what I knew then, I could have circumvented a lot of the issues I developed over the years. Balanced muscle training and proper kinetic sequences for things like running/jogging. Sounds like you provided that for your student athletes. I hope that is more common these days.

I hope I helped them as much as I like to think I did. Haha. Really I agree with you - I feel VERY lucky to have been born when I was. I wonder what chronic knee and lower back and elbow injuries I would have developed had I been born only a decade earlier?

 

[Fronkjd]

Thank you everyone for the replies. I have been taking care of my knee/hamstring and seeing my physician who does needling with e-stim. It has been hard to not be able to play, but I am getting some putting in which is nice and just staying on top of self-care.

Again, not super painful and making me unable to function but just one of those instances where you know you did something wrong and your body says "You shall not pass if you want your leg to be normal".