Lie in a tree

[Cooper2397]

I tried a search and didn't find anything.

What is the rule when your disc lies next to the trunk of a pine tree? It is literally in the tree on the ground.

Do you get any relief?

What if it is up against the trunk of an oak-- you would have to be in the trunk to get behind the disc.

I want to make sure I am plaing properly because I would like to start trying some tournaments.

Thanks

 

[Brall]

here

803.05 Obstacles and Relief
A. Obstacles to a Stance or Throwing Motion: With the exception of casual obstacles to a stance as described in 803.05 B, a player is not allowed to move any obstacle on the course. No relief is granted from park equipment (such as signs, trash cans, picnic tables, etc), which is considered part of the course. A player is allowed to request that other people remove themselves and/or their belongings from the player's stance or line of play. A player must choose the stance which results in the least movement of any obstacle. Once a legal stance is taken, the player may not move an obstacle in any way in order to make room for a throwing motion. It is legal for a player's throwing motion to cause incidental movement of an obstacle.

B. Casual Obstacles to a Stance: A player may obtain relief only from the following obstacles that are in the stance or run-up area: casual water, loose leaves or debris, broken branches no longer connected to a tree, motor vehicles, harmful insects or animals, players' equipment, people, or any item or area specifically designated by the director before the round. The player must first attempt to remove the obstacle. If it is impractical to move the obstacle, the player's lie may be relocated to the nearest lie which is no closer to the hole, is on the line of play, and is not more than five meters from the original lie, as agreed to by a majority of the group or an official (unless greater casual relief is announced by the director).

C. Optional Relief: A player may declare that he or she is taking optional relief. The lie may then be relocated to a new lie that is no closer to the hole, and on the line of play. The original throw plus one penalty throw are counted in the player's score.

D. In situations where it is unclear if an object may be moved or other relief obtained, it shall be determined by a majority of the group or an official.

E. A player shall receive one penalty throw, without a warning, for violation of an obstacle or relief rule.

F. A player who purposely damages anything on the course shall receive two penalty throws, without a warning, if observed by two or more players of the group or an
official. The player may also be disqualified from the tournament, in accordance with Section 3.3 of the Competition Manual.

 

[Cooper2397]

so basically climb into the tree and let her rip.

For the second point... if the disc is on the basket side of a trunk, can you throw from the other side of the trunk.... if it is within 2 meters? For me, it would be easier to throw a forehand with my chest against the tree then throw with my back against the tree.

Thanks for the reply.

 

[biscoe]

mark it with a mini and put your foot behind the mini...

 

[Chain Wrangler]

Also remember you cannot hold onto the tree in any way.

 

[bradharris]

What is the rule when your disc lies next to the trunk of a pine tree? It is literally in the tree on the ground.

Do you get any relief?

No. There is a rule for an unsafe lie that you can take 15 meter relief. But in the case of pine trees, I've never seen a lie that you can't manage to slide at least a foot in to get a proper stance behind the disc.

What if it is up against the trunk of an oak-- you would have to be in the trunk to get behind the disc.

I assume this is referring to a disc in between the tree and the basket? In that case you have two options. The first is you can mark your lie with a mini at the front edge of your disc. This will give you enough space between the lie and the tree to get a proper stance. The other option is to mark your lie immediately behind the tree on the line between the basket and your disc.

 

[Cooper2397]

Thanks guys....

But I won't lie (no pun intended)-- I was hoping for a completely different answer:doh:

 

[foo_g]

What happens if the disc is leaning up against a large tree on the basket side and you can't get your foot in between the tree and your mini?
Are you forced to take a penalty stroke and throw from behind the tree?

 

[bradharris]

What happens if the disc is leaning up against a large tree on the basket side and you can't get your foot in between the tree and your mini?
Are you forced to take a penalty stroke and throw from behind the tree?

I believe you can mark the lie behind the tree with no penalty. However, I can't find anything in the rulebook to justify that assertion.

 

[John Rock]

Behind the tree, no penalty.

 

[mashnut]

Not sure where the rule is, but there is one on solid object relief. If you can't take your stance in front of it, you go straight back on the line of play.

 

[John Rock]

Also remember you cannot hold onto the tree in any way.

^^^^
Always keep this in mind. You may move branches to get to your disc (if you're in a tree with lots of low-hanging branches), but once you're set up to throw don't move or hold anything out of your way.

Also remember that if a trunk is behind your lie, you may hold on to it for support. It does need to be large enough so that you're not moving attached branches with your weight on the trunk.

 

[LeppyR64]

803.04.E

 

[hangwind]

There is the throw, there are two trees in line, you can't see the second tree.

And this is where it landed. Putted it in. This is one of my first Leopard tosses, it is one of my favorite discs FH and BH, love it.

 

[LeppyR64]

From 803.04

"E. If a large solid obstacle prevents a player from taking a legal stance within 30 centimeters
directly behind the marker disc, the player shall take his or her stance immediately
behind that obstacle on the line of play. The player must comply with all the provisions of
803.04 A other than being within 30 centimeters directly behind the marker disc."

 

[hangwind]

Good to know.

One of the reasons why I'm going to take lessons. I play to the highest level that I can yet I don't know the rules, what I am supposed to do. Who throws first, all that. If I throw it out of bounds, I take a stroke and drop where I went out of bounds.

However, I want to know if I am doing this the way that I should.

I watch videos of tournaments and I play every week but the number of people I play with is limited and some day, I would like to join a league. I'm shooting to join PDGA as an amateur, get my handicap, work from there. I would like to take it up a level.

Thank you for time you took to diagram it out. I appreciate it.

 

[Norcal]

Also remember you cannot hold onto the tree in any way.

Not necessarily. This is quoted from the PDGA rule FAQ:


2006.18 : Maintaining balance while putting
Question - "I have a good rules question for you involving the stance rules. A player uses an object (in this case a branch) behind him to maintain balance for a putt. First, would this be considered "full control of balance"? Second, could you argue, if the branch is not so large that the players body weight will not move it, that it is a violation of 803.03 D and or 803.04 A because they could have moved the branch less by not hanging on it? Thanks for any input."
Response - The question can be boiled down to: Can a player hold on to an object behind his lie to maintain balance while throwing/putting?
Applicable rules: 803.04 (Stance), 803.05 (Obstacles and Relief), 804.05 (Disqualification and Suspension)
Discussion - The rules do not require that you maintain your balance while putting. You can have a grand mal seizure as long as you don't step ahead of your lie. At the time you decide to step ahead of your lie is when you have to demonstrate balance. This is simply to prove that you are not committing a falling putt, such that you would not be able to stop yourself from falling forward due to the motion of your putt. Grabbing a branch is merely acquiring another support point, which is perfectly legal, as long as it is not ahead of your lie.
Holding on to something BEHIND your lie is not prohibited by the rules, provided that the tree that the golfer is using as a supporting point is in-bounds (803.03.A (3)). The branch must not be moved, or else the player would be in violation of one or both of 803.04.D and 803.05.A, which require you to take the stance that results in the least movement of objects that are part of the course and which prohibit you from moving a branch to "make room for a throwing motion".
Conclusion - A player can hold on to something behind her lie, in certain circumstances, without violating the PDGA rules. In general that which is not prohibited by the PDGA rules is allowed, provided of course, that the action done by the player is not considered "a willful attempt to circumvent the rules of play". (This, of course, is cheating!)
Other Comments - Many members of the committee have actually tried to hold on to some object behind their lie, while leaning forward to throw or putt. In our opinion this action makes the ensuing throw/putt MORE difficult to accomplish.

http://www.pdga.com/documents/rules-questions-answers-pdf

 

[Norcal]

^^^^
Also remember that if a trunk is behind your lie, you may hold on to it for support. It does need to be large enough so that you're not moving attached branches with your weight on the trunk.

my point exactly.

 

[John Rock]

Good to know.

One of the reasons why I'm going to take lessons. I play to the highest level that I can yet I don't know the rules, what I am supposed to do. Who throws first, all that. If I throw it out of bounds, I take a stroke and drop where I went out of bounds.

However, I want to know if I am doing this the way that I should.

I watch videos of tournaments and I play every week but the number of people I play with is limited and some day, I would like to join a league. I'm shooting to join PDGA as an amateur, get my handicap, work from there. I would like to take it up a level.

Thank you for time you took to diagram it out. I appreciate it.

You will not get a handicap as a pDGA member, only tournament rounds will get a rating (kind of similar I guess). Your membership package will include a rulebook/competition manual which should answer any procedural questions you may have. Read it once, twice, three times whenever you get the chance.

 

[hangwind]

John, thanks for letting me know what to expect.

It is interesting to understand that the rules are so detailed.

Take care.