National Tour folds into DGPT

[biscoe]

Great move. Glad to see it happen.

 

[ru4por]

I wonder about two things. What happens to the AM sides of several DGPT events. Last year DGLO had an AM tournament, run by Nate, in conjunction with the pro tour event. If DGPT is not longer PDGA, are these event still under the DGPT? Are they sanctioned?

I was not overly please with Nate, making changes at Hudson Mills last year. He made decisions to clear large areas of brush and open up holes. I don't think the changes were necessary or well thought out. I don't think they made the course better for play the other 51 weeks of the year. As one of the primary clubs that works with Hudson Mill regularly and helps maintain the course, it seems kind of intrusive, to be honest.

I also wonder if the DGPT is going to expect an army of volunteers, to do their work, while they ideally continue to be a for profit venture?

 

[NOStheBOSS]

I wonder about two things. What happens to the AM sides of several DGPT events. Last year DGLO had an AM tournament, run by Nate, in conjunction with the pro tour event. If DGPT is not longer PDGA, are these event still under the DGPT? Are they sanctioned?

I was not overly please with Nate, making changes at Hudson Mills last year. He made decisions to clear large areas of brush and open up holes. I don't think the changes were necessary or well thought out. I don't think they made the course better for play the other 51 weeks of the year. As one of the primary clubs that works with Hudson Mill regularly and helps maintain the course, it seems kind of intrusive, to be honest.

I also wonder if the DGPT is going to expect an army of volunteers, to do their work, while they ideally continue to be a for profit venture?

I do not see how this announcement changes any of the things you mentioned. DGPT will continue to operate in the exact same way, running sanctioned events for both pros and ams, they just now will pick up those 4-5 events in the NT that the PDGA was previously responsible for. It will free up the PDGA to pursue other growth opportunities and allow the more prepared organization (DGPT) to run the big events other than the majors.

 

[Ryan P.]

I wonder about two things. What happens to the AM sides of several DGPT events. Last year DGLO had an AM tournament, run by Nate, in conjunction with the pro tour event. If DGPT is not longer PDGA, are these event still under the DGPT? Are they sanctioned?

I was not overly please with Nate, making changes at Hudson Mills last year. He made decisions to clear large areas of brush and open up holes. I don't think the changes were necessary or well thought out. I don't think they made the course better for play the other 51 weeks of the year. As one of the primary clubs that works with Hudson Mill regularly and helps maintain the course, it seems kind of intrusive, to be honest.

I also wonder if the DGPT is going to expect an army of volunteers, to do their work, while they ideally continue to be a for profit venture?

Can you provide a specific example of how he changed a hole that made it worse? I'd love to see before and after pics if you have them or if they're on this site.

 

[Ryan P.]

Great move. Glad to see it happen.

Interesting to hear that you're happy about it despite your issues with the DGPT choosing to avoid places with bad cell reception. Seems like if you think it's a great move (despite your hesitations with the DGPT), it's probably a great move.

 

[robdeforge]

Also, Paige was the loudest proponent. Wonder what her comments will contain/reveal?

This must've been in planning between the PDGA and DGPT for months. maybe the majority of or all of this year. must've been a little tiring to see all these pros say "YOU NEED TO DO THIS" when you're actually pretty much exactly already in the process of figuring all that out.

Look at the post pros. Patreon support but volunteer giving while still delivering significant content. I'm sure it's been tough for those folks, but damn they are doing a great job on a shoestring budget.

I assume the Jomez crew is doing very well for themselves, but not at all sure about the other production companies.

 

[ru4por]

Can you provide a specific example of how he changed a hole that made it worse? I'd love to see before and after pics if you have them or if they're on this site.

There are no pics and I don't have any. They made the course easier. Took out half of a large apple tree on 18 Monster and opened the lane to the basket across a brook. The hole played as an over the top RHBH anny flex, or a tougher RHFH big hyzer. There has always been a tough bail out, positioning play with par still an option. The changes make the bailout play much easier. IMO, the hole provided a terrific challenge on a course with many straight forward pars.

I think the changes will grow back, so I am not incensed, but it seems inappropriate to make course changes that impact years of play, based on the needs of one AM tournament.

 

[biscoe]

Interesting to hear that you're happy about it despite your issues with the DGPT choosing to avoid places with bad cell reception. Seems like if you think it's a great move (despite your hesitations with the DGPT), it's probably a great move.

My issues ended when the cell reception at the Lake improved. This merger was inevitable.

 

[ToddL]

I wonder about two things. What happens to the AM sides of several DGPT events. Last year DGLO had an AM tournament, run by Nate, in conjunction with the pro tour event. If DGPT is not longer PDGA, are these event still under the DGPT? Are they sanctioned?

https://www.pdga.com/tour/event/47877 - LVC MPO/FPO - DGPT Event
https://www.pdga.com/tour/event/47870 - LVC Other Divisions - A tier

https://www.pdga.com/tour/event/48338 - DGLO MPO/FPO - DGPT Event
https://www.pdga.com/tour/event/48339 - DGLO Amateur - A tier

Those events were never part of the DGPT. They happened to be running at the same time, and they happened to have the same TD, and since they were running at the same time they got to take advantage of the additional infrastructure that was on site, but DGPT is for MPO and FPO only.

PDGA merging the NT to DGPT has no effect on LVC or DGLO - they were DGPT last year, they'll be DGPT next year. If they ran a concurrent A tier last year, there's no reason they wouldn't be able to run a concurrent A tier next year.

 

[txmxer]

I assume the Jomez crew is doing very well for themselves, but not at all sure about the other production companies.

I assume they have positive cash flow.

I don't think they are making much more than a living. The camera crews are busting their butts so they are earning whatever they get.

 

[robdeforge]

I assume they have positive cash flow.

I don't think they are making much more than a living. The camera crews are busting their butts so they are earning whatever they get.

according to https://www.noxinfluencer.com/youtube/channel/UCmGyCEbHfY91NFwHgioNLMQ and https://socialblade.com/youtube/user/jomezproductions, they might make anywhere between 1.5 and 38K a month just from youtube.

somebody like gatekeeper media: https://www.noxinfluencer.com/youtube/channel/UCVuo7mVbv6JW-2qdbXjZbsw
estimated Monetization Capability [Monthly] is $44 - $118.

add in patreon, merch, etc..... I have no reason to think the Jomez crew isn't doing very well for themselves.

 

[ru4por]

https://www.pdga.com/tour/event/47877 - LVC MPO/FPO - DGPT Event
https://www.pdga.com/tour/event/47870 - LVC Other Divisions - A tier

https://www.pdga.com/tour/event/48338 - DGLO MPO/FPO - DGPT Event
https://www.pdga.com/tour/event/48339 - DGLO Amateur - A tier

Those events were never part of the DGPT. They happened to be running at the same time, and they happened to have the same TD, and since they were running at the same time they got to take advantage of the additional infrastructure that was on site, but DGPT is for MPO and FPO only.

PDGA merging the NT to DGPT has no effect on LVC or DGLO - they were DGPT last year, they'll be DGPT next year. If they ran a concurrent A tier last year, there's no reason they wouldn't be able to run a concurrent A tier next year.

I did not play AM side DGLO this year. They use the DGLO name for both tournament. I would be curious is DGPT gets to have free advertising, on the AM side courses? Are these AM side tournaments making money? If so, for whom? Nate? DGPT? I know Nate does engage in charity donations, is this where potential profit go? I don't remember having any opportunity to run an AM A tier up against the DGPT event. The AM event is not new, it has been run by local TD's for the last couple seasons. These are not accusations, or am I coming at Nate, I just am not sure this is what is best for my disc golf community.

It could be seen as DGPT and/or the TD taking opportunity and money out of the pockets of local clubs. For the record, part of AM side DGLO was not on site, it made use of one course 20 miles away.

 

[hanger129]

I don't think they are making much more than a living.

If you pay attention to who is operating the cameras you'll notice that Jonathan (the founder of Jomez) hasn't been filming nearly as much as he has in years past. To me that says he's at home focusing on the business side of things and perhaps other creative ideas for the channel. Or to put it another way, they have the money to hire camera operators instead of doing the majority of the heavy lifting themselves.

Also, if they were just squeaking by, I don't think they'd have the money to enhance their production as much as they have over the last year. Not to mention Jonathan just bought a house so I'm hard-pressed to think they aren't doing pretty well for themselves.

 

[The Shide]

For those of you who do not listen to podcasts, check out the latest episodes of The Upshot & Smashboxx TV. Nate & Jeff were guests on both shows & answered a lot of the questions that most people have on their disc golf lovin' minds.

 

[seedlings]

I assume they have positive cash flow.

I don't think they are making much more than a living. The camera crews are busting their butts so they are earning whatever they get.

But, uncertainty could have pushed them to get the Jomez-donor-club (or whatever it's called) going to ensure income during the hostile takeover.

(Hostile is in jest because I have no actual idea)

 

[robdeforge]

I feel like there is about a 0% chance that the complaints of the pros over the course of this year played into this. Such a major reorganization of these two organizations was almost certainly in discussion for a LONG time - I would bet anything that they've been going on longer than a few months.

I play a lot of disc golf but not as many tournaments as I used to. this won't change that, but I think it's a good chance for the sport. especially because now the pros will have to find something else to complain about

 

[JRW III]

At some point, assuming things continue to grow, I have to think DGPT will want to enforce ownership of the media rights to the events they put on. Pro sports generally guard this zealously.

ISTM that if they think they can get enough consistent eyeballs watching live coverage so that they could actually sell non-disc golf related advertisement slots for things like beer, cars, shoes, etc., then they will start to squeeze 3rd party post-production out. Live coverage is where the advertising money is at.

I hate it, but I think that's the path we are heading down.

Very possible that we are headed down that path. The recent growth has been incredible.

There are lot of things I have seen people chiming for: higher payouts for pros, more and better coverage, etc... . In order to do that, you will need the outside ad dollars. Personally, I am fine where it is, but don't have a problem with growth either.

 

[Three Putt]

Very possible that we are headed down that path. The recent growth has been incredible.

There are lot of things I have seen people chiming for: higher payouts for pros, more and better coverage, etc... . In order to do that, you will need the outside ad dollars. Personally, I am fine where it is, but don't have a problem with growth either.

It's a weird transition.

For a long time, disc golf was one thing. What the PDGA did was important to me; they wanted my donation at an A-tier and they wanted me to volunteer to TD an A tier. The Open divisions were just part of the overall thing, and I was part of that overall thing.

That wasn't the goal, though. The goal was for disc golf to go big-time and have Open Pro divisions as its own thing. The events would be run by people with actual event-organizing qualifications instead of whoever a club suckered into doing it. They would be restricted to only Open Pro players. At that point, what the PDGA would or wouldn't do so far as those Open Pro divisions wouldn't matter so much. It would be like the NBA allowing 6 personal fouls in a game; I might like it or I might not like it, but the fat man rim clankers league still only allows five so whatever. It doesn't really effect me.

So we are there, I guess. The PDGA is turning over the running of events that I'm not supposed to play in and not supposed to be organizing. It's not one big disc golf family anymore; they have their other thing and this all has to do with that thing. I could have an opinion, but it's not my circus and not my monkeys so whatever.

 

[DanJon]

Until live numbers get anywhere close to post production, I don't think we will see big third party advertisers signing on for spots in live coverage.

Jomez can't even make it on YT views, they need the Patreon support.

It would be interesting to see if the DGPT subscribers actually cover their annual operational costs for coverage.

I think a bigger push in the near future will be finding more third party sponsors for the actual tournaments, or finding corporate partners/sponsors for the entire tour.

 

[natedg1976]

Gonna need plenty of outside sponsorship money if we're talking about shifting the ratings tiers and chasing off the donor entry fees.

Amateur entry fees shouldn't be used at pro tour events. As a matter of fact amateur entry fees shouldn't be used for the pro purse at any event.