Courtesy violation for not watching a throw?

[PhillyMatt]

Joke in what way? It was a true story... Fits in perfectly with this discussion.

To philly... I didn't ask them to call it. I was just assuming they would since it was so obvious. I was basically making fun of myself.

Well that was quite the flip flop but, it was a joke. Cool. Otherwise, wow.

 

[jjpitt29]

It's called "choosing your battle". You can also be exploiting the rules by intentionally fouling for two tries on a drive.

this to me?

I don't understand how it is choosing a battle at all....

How am I exploiting the rules? Maybe on a putt you could say someone intentionally foot faulted after they new the putt wasn't in... But this was on the tee pad and in no way was intentional, lol.

 

[Grungedude42]

Kinda hard to tell via words on a screen. I'd leave it to judgement on the course. Besides, shouldn't we all be watching the disc rather than the feet on the pad? I ain't no chameleon with swivel eyes, brother.

 

[Aim For The Chains]

Big brother is always watching.







*puts on Reynolds Wrap hat*






*Heads to DGC and spies on all the players* --- don't worry I am always watching and so are "they".

 

[jjpitt29]

Well that was quite the flip flop but, it was a joke. Cool. Otherwise, wow.

Not sure we are on the same thought plane here. It wasn't a joke. I asked them if they were gonna call it, because it was so bad. IF I could have I would have called it on myself.

The question is... This was a complete violation that they missed. Not even a questionable call. Since they all said they didn't see the obvious fault are they open to being called on the rule we are discussing?

Not saying I would call it, since I obviously didn't. Not sure I would ever, because of the reaction like most of you here. Hell, calling a foot fault on someone can be a damn near nuclear event sometimes.

But in context of the discussion that is going on, I thought it was a perfect example, but the only responses that people seem to want to throw out there is... well I won't say it, but it's not good imo. But I suppose that's par for the course as society goes.

 

[jjpitt29]

Kinda hard to tell via words on a screen. I'd leave it to judgement on the course. Besides, shouldn't we all be watching the disc rather than the feet on the pad? I ain't no chameleon with swivel eyes, brother.

You're telling me you can't watch someones feet while they throw and then turn your head to see the disc in the air? Holy ****, I must be some kind of super human then... *sarcasm font*

 

[JC17393]

Oh I see your plan. Since you made that post you can now propose the most annoying and assanine possibilities and just fall back on it when someone calls you out on it?

That's actually a pretty solid plan.

I didn't realize that jjpitt and I are the same person.

My point isn't to open the door to "annoying and asinine" possibilities. It's to allow for discussion of rules and rules applications without the conversation digressing into yet another referendum on how people who want to discuss and dissect rules and rules scenarios are unfun a-holes.

We're discussing the courtesy rule and how it may or may not be applied in situations where players fail to observe players as the rule requests. Crap like "Sounds miserable to play with some of you" or "I'd punch you in your face right there on the teepad" is exactly what I'm talking about in terms of digressions. It doesn't do anything to contribute to the conversation, so what's the point?

 

[jjpitt29]

I didn't realize that jjpitt and I are the same person.

My point isn't to open the door to "annoying and asinine" possibilities. It's to allow for discussion of rules and rules applications without the conversation digressing into yet another referendum on how people who want to discuss and dissect rules and rules scenarios are unfun a-holes.

We're discussing the courtesy rule and how it may or may not be applied in situations where players fail to observe players as the rule requests. Crap like "Sounds miserable to play with some of you" or "I'd punch you in your face right there on the teepad" is exactly what I'm talking about in terms of digressions. It doesn't do anything to contribute to the conversation, so what's the point?

ya, I don't think JC would like to be associated with me, lol. Even though we agree on most everything it seems.

 

[JC17393]

ya, I don't think JC would like to be associated with me, lol. Even though we agree on most everything it seems.

Depends on how we're associated, I suppose.

I try not to take anything personal on here. I'm sure most everyone would be a pleasure to play with or just spend time hanging out with, and I hope folks would feel the same about me. All that regardless of what's said on the message boards.

I enjoy discussing and debating rules including pushing the edges and debating unlikely and extreme situations, but that's on the forum or in casual conversation. That doesn't mean I'm whipping the rule book out and nit-picking every little possible thing during a round. Some people seem to think that's what these kinds of discussions lead to, and make that point by acting like high school jocks making fun of the nerds in the lunchroom. It gets old and annoying.

 

[BogeyNoMore]

Sportsmanship people - please learn it.

Sounds miserable to play with some of you.

:hfive:

 

[juju]

lol @ this thread

 

[WhiteyBear]

Well, the rule does specifically say you should watch "in order to aid in locating errant throws". Doesn't that imply you should watch the flight of the disc? After all, if you don't watch the disc, how can you aid in locating it? And that's regardless of whether the thrower falls down, stays on his feet, or does six cartwheels in his follow through.

I mean, if we're going to play #rulesstickler, let's play.

Everyone you reach your disc I'm going to say "30 seconds starts....now"

 

[BogeyNoMore]

Wait... most tourneys send out four on a card - why not designate roles?

Player A: watches Player D's disc.
Player B: watches Player D for foot faults.
Player C: watches Player D to make sure they're OK in case they fall.

There, we're covered. :\




... or maybe we could just use common sense.

 

[teemkey]

I also consider the consequences of stance violations. If it appears the player is attempting to gain an advantage by violating the rules I'm much more apt to call a stance violation. If it appears the player is simply unaware of breaking the rules, then I will start the one, two, three, four sequence mentioned above.

BTW, who's being harmed by courtesy violations?

 

[mashnut]

I also consider the consequences of stance violations. If it appears the player is attempting to gain an advantage by violating the rules I'm much more apt to call a stance violation. If it appears the player is simply unaware of breaking the rules, then I will start the one, two, three, four sequence mentioned above.

BTW, who's being harmed by courtesy violations?

I think that the definition of gaining an advantage needs to be looked at by the people who think this way. If I don't have to worry about getting my plant foot exactly behind my mark then I can put a lot more concentration into hitting my line. Being able to do a full speed runup and actually hitting your mark takes a lot of practice and concentration, and it definitely is an advantage to not put in that effort.

 

[WhiteyBear]

I think that the definition of gaining an advantage needs to be looked at by the people who think this way. If I don't have to worry about getting my plant foot exactly behind my mark then I can put a lot more concentration into hitting my line. Being able to do a full speed runup and actually hitting your mark takes a lot of practice and concentration, and it definitely is an advantage to not put in that effort.

Which to me, still, is one of the dumbest aspects of our game...

I'm fine with the run-up during the drive, but to say "OK I'm going to backup 40 feet, run as fast as I can and throw the disc", but to not allow a step-though inside 33 feet...is ridiculously dumb.

Would be way simpler if it were just ZERO run-up on any shot outside of the drive, or only an X-step/6 foot rule.

 

[mashnut]

Which to me, still, is one of the dumbest aspects of our game...

I'm fine with the run-up during the drive, but to say "OK I'm going to backup 40 feet, run as fast as I can and throw the disc", but to not allow a step-though inside 33 feet...is ridiculously dumb.

Would be way simpler if it were just ZERO run-up on any shot outside of the drive, or only an X-step/6 foot rule.

That's a different debate, I'm personally on the side of allowing a follow through on any shot and just eliminating the 10m circle. Under the current rules though I stand by my point above.

 

[jjohnson2012]

I think if you are not watching if I threw OB I can drop my disc where I want to. You can't really call out my spot cause you "weren't watching". I'm not calling out anyone on here, but I really wish recreational rounds were played a bit more serious. I don't throw tournaments yet, but play regular rounds with all the same rules. Then I see all these kids breaking down branches and even full trees to clear a line for their shot, or leaving trash around. I know it's not possible to enforce BUT I wouldn't mind seeing those players be serious about their game and respect the course/other players. And if they cant, they should not be allowed on a course.

Wow, that kind of got away from me! But that was my rant for today ��

 

[Toro71]

Failing to watch another's shot to help track it is a rule I think most people wouldn't ever call. The point of it, I'm sure, is to avoid slow play ultimately, which is fine, but if it's me, and I'm testing a guy by saying "hey, did you see where that went? No? Warning." is like blaming them for my bad shot.

I'd say I watch like 95% of cardmates throws, just because I'm interested in what's happening. You'll always miss the occasional one taking a wizz or what not.

The other thing, overstepping the front of the tee pad...I'm the worst kind of 'official,' because in practice I believe in the 'spirit' not the 'letter' of a rule. It's hard to imagine how missing the front of the teepad results in advantage, or does anything other than cause a disadvantage.

I hear what Mashnut is saying, but I feel like that applies more to fairway runups.

 

[Toro71]

I think if you are not watching if I threw OB I can drop my disc where I want to.

For a rules stickler, you sure do seem pretty willing to bend them to your advantage...