I think Val got burned.

[JC17393]

And if the TD had decided not to DQ, do you think that the PDGA wouldn't have supported that?

That perhaps they would overridden him?

Yes.

 

[_MTL_]

Of course they will misread their own rule because they wrote it thinking it meant something else when even a third grader can follow the logical syntax to the correct conclusion.

In this very thread you have multiple times said that the DQ was allowed by the rules and you have simply argued that the point of whether it was mandatory or not. I've also never seen anything where the TD or the PDGA stated they had to DQ and it was mandatory.

So I'm not sure why you think they misread their own rule.

 

[_MTL_]

We have been discussing this for 42 pages.

No one at any point has disputed that the TD had the right to DQ.

So I'm not sure why this is even going on?

OOOOOH it's because people don't know the rules, think that professional disc golf should be a kegger and hate anything the PDGA does.

 

[Grippenripp]

All of this is Bullpuckey. A mistake WAS indeed made, admitted, and apologized for. That having been said. Bullpuckey!! Val is a great FPO player. As she said "a lapse in judgement was made". Sonin hindsight, I think whoever the player was that made mention, or marshal, or TD shoukd have let them have that family moment together. It was a quickfire decision that by the books, yes, was wrong but seriously, get over it. If she had a caddy who was hammered drunk and disturbing other players, pace of play, the spectators, course etc. I could see this playing out. Now we move forward and let Val be Val and keep doing amazing things for the sport.

 

[Noill]

@mtl... I disagree...the awkwardness of this situation suggests something is wrong with these particular rules. I think most are saying that the rule does say DQ and so is correct as the rules state; however, a mom with an empty for only the last four holes!!! Something is not exactly making sense here. I really think there should be a little more discretion available to the TD so that he can make more appropriate decisions in cases like this.

This is often how rules evolve. A situation occurs that hadnt been considered before... forcing a person to find the closest fitting rule. Others see this and know something is off.

 

[_MTL_]

@mtl... I disagree...the awkwardness of this situation suggests something is wrong with these particular rules. I think most are saying that the rule does say DQ and so is correct as the rules state; however, a mom with an empty for only the last four holes!!! Something is not exactly making sense here. I really think there should be a little more discretion available to the TD so that he can make more appropriate decisions in cases like this.

This is often how rules evolve. A situation occurs that hadnt been considered before... forcing a person to find the closest fitting rule. Others see this and know something is off.

Outside of Val's statement, I've seen no evidence that suggests the beer can was empty.

I'd be beyond floored if a player was DQed for their caddy carrying an empty beer can for 4 holes. Floored. Resign from the disciplinary committee level floored.

 

[Noill]

I believe Val... No reason to doubt her as she is professional and took this rather well. A lot of rules favor the player where there is doubt. Why not here too? Probably because the rule wasn't meant for this exact situation, but was applied all the same.

 

[Noill]

When can we expect your resignation? Today is Friday... always a good day to quit.

 

[brutalbrutus]

She probably down it before picking up the bag.

 

[_MTL_]

When can we expect your resignation? Today is Friday... always a good day to quit.

All DQ's come to me. If you see me resign in the next month, you'll know why. If you don't, you'll know why.

 

[Noill]

opcorn:

 

[Noill]

Seriously though, good luck on the DQ review and think about it...I for one would appreciate it. DGCR likes to tear a thing all the way down, but we're mostly just bored at work. Don't take it all too literally.

Another thing to think about...and I'm unsure of the weight of it, but this sort of looks like a PR issue...this was a top pro's mother we're talking about... over a potentially empty can...a warning would have played so much better.

 

[dashiellx]

Really, a lot of this discussion could have been avoided if the relationship between caddie and player was more defined. The rule should clearly state that any infraction by a caddie will result in punishment on the player.

Additionally, I'm not 100% comfy with the idea that any Joe/Jane Schmoo can be a caddie. Or that caddie can just be brought in mid-round for any reason but injury that makes carrying a bag difficult.

The requirements to qualify as a caddie should be the same as those that qualify one to compete in the tournament.

but we're mostly just bored at work.

Preach!

 

[onemilemore]

Who cares how the PDGA interprets the rule? The PDGA is made up of lowlier lowlives than your average suburban bowling league. The ballots look like the Libertarian party primary. Of course they will misread their own rule because they wrote it thinking it meant something else when even a third grader can follow the logical syntax to the correct conclusion. Unfortunately that is the thing about written rules, you follow them as written not as the beer addled PDGA rules committee pictured them in their own mind's eye.

Brb guys, gotta go meet up with Big Ern and the rest of the crew down at the lanes and knock down some piiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiinnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnzzzzzzzzzzzzzz.

 

[_MTL_]

Brb guys, gotta go meet up with Big Ern and the rest of the crew down at the lanes and knock down some piiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiinnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnzzzzzzzzzzzzzz.

LOLZ

 

[dorseymatt]

Yeah, it seems a bit silly that someone can become a caddie mid-round.

Of course, not as silly as a DQ for carrying an empty can.

 

[_MTL_]

Seriously though, good luck on the DQ review and think about it...I for one would appreciate it. DGCR likes to tear a thing all the way down, but we're mostly just bored at work. Don't take it all too literally.

Another thing to think about...and I'm unsure of the weight of it, but this sort of looks like a PR issue...this was a top pro's mother we're talking about... over a potentially empty can...a warning would have played so much better.

I don't review the validity of a DQ, only if additional discipline is needed.

 

[BuiltTooLong]

Outside of Val's statement, I've seen no evidence that suggests the beer can was empty.

I'd be beyond floored if a player was DQed for their caddy carrying an empty beer can for 4 holes. Floored. Resign from the disciplinary committee level floored.

So you are calling Val a liar then?

 

[ThrowBot]

All DQ's come to me. If you see me resign in the next month, you'll know why. If you don't, you'll know why.

I can just picture the resignation letter now...

Not that anyone cares, but I want this to be public.

I just had a few PM's with Tim G regarding the titles and how pathetic I think it is that not only can someone change someone's title, but it's permanent AND he profits off of it.

Ok, I get that it's all in good fun and of course what inspired this was my current title. Trust me, I get it. I come across like a know it all or what not but trust me, I know I'm not important in the grand scheme of the sport. My resume in our sport is pretty lengthy and I don't care if people know about what I have done and what I do for the sport.

But what if I submitted something slanderous about someone? I was told that if it was offensive / profantity it wouldn't go through. Well guess what, I'm offended by mine. When I requested it be removed, he stated I or someone else would have to pay for it to be changed. Seriously?

For those of you that have learned something from my posts or have asked me questions, I'm sorry it has come to this. I get that they are supposed to be a joke but where I draw the line is that Tim profits off of them AND they are permanent. One week? sure. But forever? Seriously?

It's funny to me that people complain left and right about things in our sport and money. Does Tim donate the money he makes off this? Maybe. I'm not sure. Has he lost tons of money building this site and is only trying to recover it? Maybe I'm not sure. But the PDGA would never ever do anything remotely close to this.

However I just think it's absolutely pathetic that I could generally be trying to help someone on this site answering questions about tournaments or being a state coordinator or whatever else and they see my title and think "well, I better not read this."

Later DGCR. I wonder how long this goes before lock / landfill?

 

[wolfmandragon]

We have been discussing this for 42 pages.

No one at any point has disputed that the TD had the right to DQ.

So I'm not sure why this is even going on?

OOOOOH it's because people don't know the rules, think that professional disc golf should be a kegger and hate anything the PDGA does.

You are a board member, correct? If you want people to respect the PDGA, perhaps you should act more professional.

Many of us only have contact with the PDGA here and all the PR is bad. For myself, I have no interest in joining, and the primary reason is from what I have seen go on on DGCR.

This is not an attack on you personally; it is criticism and if you will allow it, constructive.