2023 GOLF (yes, the other golf) rules

[Steve West]

First: No one wants to make golf more like golf for the sake of being more like golf!

This thread is about:

1. Thinking about whether to adopt and adapt some concepts.

2. To gloat when they adopt some of ours.

I'd like to cover just one new rule per post.

 

[Steve West]

I'll start with the new rule that allows more clubs to be carried (18) and allows players to replace clubs that break. They are moving in our direction.

 

[Steve West]

A new concept is Ground Already Covered. Say the ball goes OB, the player can drop anywhere along the line of GAC. This is a straight line from where the ball was last in-bounds, back to where the stroke was made. (The line does not follow the curve of the flight of the ball.)

If we applied this to disc golf, it could replace Line of Play. Instead of moving back farther along the line from the target to the disc and beyond, relief would be to move anywhere along the straight line that runs from the position of the thrown disc (or last point IB) to the previous lie.

The two advantages I see are:

1. The player has "earned" the line of GAC, so it's more like play it where it lies.

2. Unlike LOP relief, there would always be a spot where relief could be taken along the line. Most of the time the player would be able to gain significant distance, because usually the GAC line would be over an IB area. But, worst case it becomes like a re-throw.

 

[BillFleming]

A new concept is Ground Already Covered. Say the ball goes OB, the player can drop anywhere along the line of GAC. This is a straight line from where the ball was last in-bounds, back to where the stroke was made. (The line does not follow the curve of the flight of the ball.)

If we applied this to disc golf, it could replace Line of Play. Instead of moving back farther along the line from the target to the disc and beyond, relief would be to move anywhere along the straight line that runs from the position of the thrown disc (or last point IB) to the previous lie.

The two advantages I see are:

1. The player has "earned" the line of GAC, so it's more like play it where it lies.

2. Unlike LOP relief, there would always be a spot where relief could be taken along the line. Most of the time the player would be able to gain significant distance, because usually the GAC line would be over an IB area. But, worst case it becomes like a re-throw.

This would be nice if it removes the current rule of 806.02.D.2. That rule is nice, but it can give an unfair advantage of moving the disc closer to the target.

So take a lie somewhere along the GAC, but no closer to the target. It would also eliminate trying to find a lie on an uneven ground within one meter of the spot where the disc went OB - you would just go further back on the GAC.

 

[ThrowBot]

I'll start with the new rule that allows more clubs to be carried (18) and allows players to replace clubs that break. They are moving in our direction.

I never understood the quantity limitations of golf clubs. Like, I know it's a thing, but why? You're only swinging 1 club at a time. Does it matter that much how many clubs are in your bag when you use one at a time?

Would there be any competitive advantage to having 50 clubs with you? Honest question. I don't know a lot about bolf.

To my intuition, the clubs should be like discs: you can carry as many as you want... but only you know how many you can use effectively. Setting up your bag is a part of the gamesmanship.

 

[Cgkdisc]

I never understood the quantity limitations of golf clubs. Like, I know it's a thing, but why? You're only swinging 1 club at a time. Does it matter that much how many clubs are in your bag when you use one at a time?

Would there be any competitive advantage to having 50 clubs with you? Honest question. I don't know a lot about bolf.

To my intuition, the clubs should be like discs: you can carry as many as you want... but only you know how many you can use effectively. Setting up your bag is a part of the gamesmanship.

The old 14-club rule appeared to be more about bag weight limitations to help caddies than it was for competition reasons. And, I suspect they also want to avoid caddies needing to pull a cart of clubs, balls and other equipment. Perhaps the USGA feels clubs are lighter and 18 are now the equivalent of 14 older clubs? Seems like they should have allowed clubs where the face angle can be adjusted in the field but that would reduce the number of different clubs players would need and their sponsors could sell.

 

[ThrowBot]

Seems like they should have allowed clubs where the face angle can be adjusted in the field but that would reduce the number of different clubs players would need and their sponsors could sell.

[Puts on Mechanical Engineer hat]

An adjustment mechanism would probably become a weak point in the device, adding possible failure points that may pose a safety risk. At the very least I'd worry about excessive deformation within the club head during a strike.

[/M.E. hat]

 

[Cgkdisc]

[Puts on Mechanical Engineer hat]

An adjustment mechanism would probably become a weak point in the device, adding possible failure points that may pose a safety risk. At the very least I'd worry about excessive deformation within the club head during a strike.

[/M.E. hat]

While that makes sense, we know these adjustable clubs have been available and used by recreational players for many years. If mechanical failure was discovered to be a problem, I doubt they would continue to be sold if liability cost became an issue. I'm thinking the look of players/caddies making equipment adjustments in the field may appear "unprofessional" especially since balls and clubs are checked out and approved in advance for each player competing.

 

[_MTL_]

Would there be any competitive advantage to having 50 clubs with you? Honest question. I don't know a lot about bolf.

Yes. Very much so.

Most players always have:
Driver
3 Wood
4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9 iron
a Wedge
A putter

After that, the 4 extra clubs are all over the place.
4 wood
5 wood
7 wood
1 iron
2 iron
3 iron
Hybrids of all long irons
Wedges ranging from 48 degrees to 64 degrees.

Choosing those extra 4 clubs is a strategy and a skill.

 

[tastes like plastik]

hello folks! 18 clubs? Is this for real? y'all got a link? just wondering.

 

[Steve West]

hello folks! 18 clubs? Is this for real? y'all got a link? just wondering.

Here.

Finding anything more official in the USGA or RaA sites is much harder. However, as we are just using them as fodder for generating ideas for disc golf, I don't really care how official they really are.

 

[tastes like plastik]

yeah, ok. Thanks fir the link, GHA? I have been playing ball golf for decades, and never heard of the GHA.

 

[_MTL_]

yeah, ok. Thanks fir the link, GHA? I have been playing ball golf for decades, and never heard of the GHA.

agreed. And im from Raleigh, where it's from apparently.

 

[dmoore1998]

I never understood the quantity limitations of golf clubs. Like, I know it's a thing, but why? You're only swinging 1 club at a time. Does it matter that much how many clubs are in your bag when you use one at a time?

Would there be any competitive advantage to having 50 clubs with you? Honest question. I don't know a lot about bolf.

To my intuition, the clubs should be like discs: you can carry as many as you want... but only you know how many you can use effectively. Setting up your bag is a part of the gamesmanship.

Mostly so that caddies (often younger children) didn't have to carry around a bag full of 50 clubs. A bigger deal 75-100 years ago when there were no carts, and caddies weren't primarily limited to professionals (and frankly for unsanctioned/non-tournament play...tons of people have their golf carts loaded up with a lot of clubs).

There isn't a lot of competitive advantage to having 50 clubs with you...just like there isn't much advantage to having 50 discs. The biggest advantage would be that you could have 2 of everything, so you could throw a tantrum and break/lose a club and still have another in the bag lol.

 

[Cgkdisc]

Thanks for posting, Steve. These recent ball golf innovations should open up further discussion in the PDGA RC, Board and CompCom regarding rules and play format tweaks that have been proposed by several of us over the years that have been primarily set aside or rejected for the traditional but unnecessary restriction that "ball golf doesn't do it".

 

[Steve West]

Thanks for posting, Steve. These recent ball golf innovations should open up further discussion in the PDGA RC, Board and CompCom regarding rules and play format tweaks that have been proposed by several of us over the years that have been primarily set aside or rejected for the traditional but unnecessary restriction that "ball golf doesn't do it".

I don't know....

I've been on the RC for 10 years and can't remember ever hearing that. Maybe it's just CC thinking? Or a longer-ago problem?

 

[Cgkdisc]

I don't know....

I've been on the RC for 10 years and can't remember ever hearing that. Maybe it's just CC thinking? Or a longer-ago problem?

Formalizing score capping for example. However, the fact BG is willing to radically revise traditional restrictions may persuade our authorities that we're able to blaze our own path without waiting for BG to make the first move.

 

[Steve West]

Formalizing score capping for example. However, the fact BG is willing to radically revise traditional restrictions may persuade our authorities that we're able to blaze our own path without waiting for BG to make the first move.

There have been several cases of doing things before golf, or independently from golf.

As for score capping, there are a lot of reasons against adopting it besides "golf doesn't". I think it will need to wait for a better understanding of how unrelated to skill the very big scores are. (Or, as some would aver, the PDGA would have to start caring about Masters and Ams.)

But, while we're near the subject, one new thing for golf handicapping (not for "real" tournaments, if my understanding is correct) is to expand the existing score capping by first limiting the score to what it would have been with 3 putts.

I don't see how a 3-putt cap would help disc golf. (Would ours be a two-putt cap? Would we count all throws after the disc first lands in the circle?) A total score limit - if that's a good idea - would work well enough.

 

[PMantle]

hello folks! 18 clubs? Is this for real? y'all got a link? just wondering.

No, this isn't a 2023 rule change.

 

[Steve West]

No, this isn't a 2023 rule change.

Correct, not for "real" golf. The GHA is some sort of wannabe org, I guess. Still, since we don't need to copy either fake or real golf, we can use their ideas as fodder. With perhaps less credence as to their vettedness.

(The USGA WILL allow a player to replace a damaged club in 2023. Here.)