Post here being used to build cases against disc golf

[Kenny53691]

Sadly, this little personal crusade will get him nowhere. The sport will continue to grow regardless of what happens in his backyard.

I hope you're right, but once one idiot shows up, other seem to come out from the wood work.

 

[simpletwist]

More fuel for my fire.

PRIVATE COURSES!

 

[Basshunter]

In any multi-use park/"open space" that is open to the public, common sense would seem to dictate that one user should be mindful of the actions of all other users, and that common courtesy would dictate that one would defer to the user that was in that general area first. Let me use one of my other addictions as an example. As a fly-fisherman, I would never position myself directly upstream of another angler who was on the water before me. Prime spot or not, there is someone expecting, reasonably, that their selection of that spot gives them safe passage to fish that general area without encroachment. For further explanation, I'm talking about small water here, just like a park with limited space.

Sadly, to paraphrase the saying, neither common sense nor common courtesy are all that common anymore. The agenda of the individual and groups that prompted the original post aside, it is (unfortunately perhaps) the responsibility of all of us disc golfers to work hard to portray disc golf in a positive light. Let the local papers and news stations know about tournaments and events that raise money for local charities, of clubs doing park cleanups, etc. Let people know that disc golfers are caring and supportive members of the community...and shut bleepholes like this guy up.

 

[Basshunter]

More fuel for my fire.

PRIVATE COURSES!

And this! :thmbup:

 

[BogeyNoMore]

I think the following posts bear repeating:

Ken McGary is a dedicated and dangerous troll. Born out of today's social media age, a nut job with an agenda. Most people are satisfied having an opinion and allowing popular sentiment rule policy. Not Ken, he is willing to put the power of social media to work with propaganda, misdirection, dishonest, and lying to pass off the minority opinion as truth. Most of the time, left alone and given no attention, the Kens go away. Once in a while though, you run across someone whos inflated idea of self worth is so great, they see no world outside the one in their head. Careful what you say on the interwebz, it is there for everyone to see.

While these militant anti-DG knuckleheads need to get a life, we should acknowledge that we are bringing some of this on ourselves by allowing courses to be installed where they present a real hazard to other users of the park.

There was a recent review of Resoft Park in Alvin, TX that spoke to that, and the pictures confirm that this course never should have been installed when walking paths and playground equipment are in the line of play. Same with a new course around here that I reviewed - Tipp City in Dayton. There are many other examples - heck, even Idlewild has a few spots where you have to be really careful.

Of course I would expect walkers who are wandering in our fairways away from playgrounds and picnic tables to watch out and they should accept a fair amount of responsibility if they are hit, but when they are using defined walking paths, or for God's sake, watching their kids play baseball on a defined field then the problem is primarily ours.

Sure, we all want to see as many DG courses in the ground as possible to give us more playing options, but if we keep stuffing them in "multi-use" parks like this then we are going to have to deal with the Green wackos citing these sort of accidents to justify their "save the flora and fauna" cries. In fact, in the more extreme examples like Resoft, we should be the first to declare it unplayable and explain to the appropriate officials that someone could get hurt. IMO that would only help our larger cause...

Excellent points on both counts, gentlemen!

 

[Peterb]

Here's a picture of Ken bushwhacking to get a nature photo. Odd, since his main critique of disc golf is the bushwhacking nature of the sport. I guess we can't all practice what we preach.

 

[mashnut]

Sadly, this little personal crusade will get him nowhere. The sport will continue to grow regardless of what happens in his backyard.

It doesn't take much for a park department to start thinking of disc golf as a potential lawsuit and take it out of their plans. Same reason you don't see teeter totters or tall metal slides installed in new parks. Instead of shooting the messenger, why not learn from it and start actually acting like a real park activity that gets planned with safety and potential issues in mind instead of pretending we're safe and smart to add to any old park. It's also an opportunity to advocate for real course designers, you get someone like Houck, Kennedy or McDaniel involved and you won't have a course that looks like Polliwog Park, they'd tell the parks department it's not a suitable place for a course and help them find a better and safer location.

 

[Peterb]

It doesn't take much for a park department to start thinking of disc golf as a potential lawsuit and take it out of their plans. Same reason you don't see teeter totters or tall metal slides installed in new parks. Instead of shooting the messenger, why not learn from it and start actually acting like a real park activity that gets planned with safety and potential issues in mind instead of pretending we're safe and smart to add to any old park. It's also an opportunity to advocate for real course designers, you get someone like Houck, Kennedy or McDaniel involved and you won't have a course that looks like Polliwog Park, they'd tell the parks department it's not a suitable place for a course and help them find a better and safer location.

:thmbup:

moreover, it is time we stop looking to park departments for land in urban areas. It is time we begin to band together to raise funds for private courses. The money is there...let's make it happen.

 

[BrotherDave]

I'm placing a flyer of the Polliwog incident story on my course's bulletin board, along with a message to state the obvious and exercise caution before they throw. I've also mentioned SMP by name. The more every DG'ers knows about these loons and their agenda, the better.

I don't know what you are talking about.

 

[BogeyNoMore]

It doesn't take much for a park department to start thinking of disc golf as a potential lawsuit and take it out of their plans. Same reason you don't see teeter totters or tall metal slides installed in new parks. Instead of shooting the messenger, why not learn from it and start actually acting like a real park activity that gets planned with safety and potential issues in mind instead of pretending we're safe and smart to add to any old park. It's also an opportunity to advocate for real course designers, you get someone like Houck, Kennedy or McDaniel involved and you won't have a course that looks like Polliwog Park, they'd tell the parks department it's not a suitable place for a course and help them find a better and safer location.

Not to mention the additional benefit of better courses. Do we really want courses everywhere one can be shoe-horned in? Maybe it's better to select locations and designers that will give us quality courses instead of "just another course" ... or worse.

 

[Whirlwind Disc Golf]

I applaud all of you for being so dedicate to growing our great sport in a considerate and sustainable way.

Unfortunately, there will always be a few fellow supporters who, either by naivete or assholiness, will keep providing PR fodder to the anti-DG propagandists. I'm afraid there's no way to completely prevent either the fodder or the amplification.

We need to define our sport, not let others do it for us. I think we need to coordinate our response to the primary themes coming from SMP and the like, to proactively establish higher ground. I'm envisioning a website with blunt and extensive information about each pain point: safety, environment, monopolizing space, etc. I think we'll win more battles this way compared to the current hand-to-hand combat where we struggle to keep up with the mud they sling, where we work as individuals on damage control.

sidenote: the leaders of SMP aren't a group of "eco-nazis" and "hippies". they are angry/bored/mean/sad people who want to feel important, who want revenge against happy people. (read: sociopaths). their supporters are primarily NIMBYs who are proud (embarrassed) of "their" mostly empty 300+ acre park and are uncomfortable with people unlike themselves... SMP would have accused players of pedophilia if they thought it would work. IMO, in SF politics, pseudo-environmentalism is 2nd only to dog-walking as the most effective, er, dog whistle.

 

[zenbot]

Dude! This is why I moved away from California! The people are crazy!!

You sure you don't want to come back, hun?

 

[joecoin]

... We need to define our sport, not let others do it for us. I think we need to coordinate our response to the primary themes coming from SMP and the like, to proactively establish higher ground. I'm envisioning a website with blunt and extensive information about each pain point: safety, environment, monopolizing space, etc. ...

sidenote: the leaders of SMP aren't a group of "eco-nazis" and "hippies". they are angry/bored/mean/sad people who want to feel important, who want revenge against happy people. (read: sociopaths)...

A worthy goal, this proposed website. Fight fire with fire. Unfortunately, that means you need to find some angry/bored/mean/sad disc golfers to build and maintain said website. Good luck.

 

[DavidSauls]

A worthy goal, this proposed website. Fight fire with fire. Unfortunately, that means you need to find some angry/bored/mean/sad disc golfers to build and maintain said website. Good luck.

Not necessarily. You could have a website documenting the benefits to parks of disc golf. Citing places where disc golf installations have reduced crime reports and cleaned up parks, particularly in urban areas. Examples of disc golfers improving parks with tree plantings, etc. Examples of funds raised for local charities at events on disc golf courses. And so on.

All of this information already exists, but you could build a site that extolls and documents it. A resource for proposals to parks departments. Saveyourparkwithdiscgolf.com, so to speak.

It wouldn't help much in this particular case, for reasons flabbydaddy so well laid out. It might not help much, anywhere. But it would be a positive response, much better than just slinging mud back at the NIMBYs.

 

[BogeyNoMore]

Not necessarily. You could have a website documenting the benefits to parks of disc golf. Citing places where disc golf installations have reduced crime reports and cleaned up parks, particularly in urban areas. Examples of disc golfers improving parks with tree plantings, etc. Examples of funds raised for local charities at events on disc golf courses. And so on.

All of this information already exists, but you could build a site that extolls and documents it. A resource for proposals to parks departments. Saveyourparkwithdiscgolf.com, so to speak.

It wouldn't help much in this particular case, for reasons flabbydaddy so well laid out. It might not help much, anywhere. But it would be a positive response, much better than just slinging mud back at the NIMBYs.

I, too, like the idea, and it would seem we have the people here to do it. Just read this thread for all the posts advocating the responsible installation of courses. Our club (Motor City Chain Gang) raises money for a local soup kitchen at pretty much every big tournament they run, and I'm pretty sure stuff like that happens all over the place, but we (the DG community) don't have a one stop shopping / central repository for all the positive PR related to DG.

 

[Menacewarf]

Here's a picture of Ken bushwhacking to get a nature photo. Odd, since his main critique of disc golf is the bushwhacking nature of the sport. I guess we can't all practice what we preach.

Lol. Yea. Reminds me of the original thread where he said he didn't want disc golf in his parks so (paraphrased) "his kids could frolic, climb trees, and shove sticks in ant holes."

Wait so you don't want us in the park because we might damage trees or impinge on creatures SO that your kids can use that very park to damage trees and mess with creatures? :| sounds legit

 

[Matthew boals]

Icebowlhq.com would be the best place to start, IMHO.

 

[filobedo]

Not sure if anyone has seen all of the threads that are being captured from this site to build cases against disc golf? Might need to increase the security?

http://savemclarenpark.org/SMP4_dgsafety.html

Interesting read and the site appears to be very thorough and created with evidence and documentation. Another perspective is this could be an opportunity to bring the community together through a compromise if both parties (the supporters of the site and supporters of the local course) could maintain a rational dialogue and maturity level during the process of discussion and going forward.

I am curious if a disgruntled dger is behind this but it is unsettling to read the stories about the animals. I only asks this because in 2006 or 2007, a small group of rec/casual players in the Charleston area created a league that lasted 1 - 2 months in response to their disdaine for the Charleston DGC and organized dg in Charleston. The leader of the group ended up printing flyers, posted them around town and at a local course which reflected opposition to organized play such as rules and etiquette (the most ridiculous parts of the flyer was a picture of a guy standing in waist deep water putting on #8 or #11 at Trophy Lakes and the flyer referenced that the group was for people that enjoyed partying and chasing girls instead of practicing putting). The crazy part about this was the Charleston club only had about 20 - 30 people active back then and the majority of locals played at the pay to play course and not a public park and everyone was really laid back compared to now.

 

[Norcal]

I think the city had proposed to build one and then this guy and others freaked out because they are park walkers and have crazy environmental issues where they think people walking around throwing discs is terrible on the eco system.

While I wouldn't entirely discount environmental concerns, in this case they are a pretext. In fact, this is a NIMBY issue disguised as an environmental issue.

 

[Peterb]

Lol. Yea. Reminds me of the original thread where he said he didn't want disc golf in his parks so (paraphrased) "his kids could frolic, climb trees, and shove sticks in ant holes."

Wait so you don't want us in the park because we might damage trees or impinge on creatures SO that your kids can use that very park to damage trees and mess with creatures? :| sounds legit

we can all agree that kids need places to do the things he talked about without being on a disc golf course. Of course they need that. There's enough room in that park to make everyone happy. The real irony is that the person who has a problem with all the bushwhacking that goes on in disc golf is a bushwhacker himself. Of course, it's for a much more noble cause, so it's rationalized as ok.