Review pet peeve - blind baskets

[Dave242]

One of my pet peeves here is people who put blind baskets as a con in their reviews since it made their first time through more difficult and less fun. That is a bogus con! Courses are not designed for drive-by reviewers, but for people who will play the course repeatedly.

Blind basket locations almost always make the course better since they add skill and they add a little excitement/anticipation/trepidation once your disc is in the air. IMO, that adds to the fun-factor.

On the flip side, holes with multiple blind pins that do not have maps showing the current position of the basket is a legit con. It is legit since locals/regulars will repeatedly have to walk down the fairway to scope things out to see where the basket is today.

 

[rikardob]

Agree. (Blind holes are great proving there is a legit line.)

What do you think about baskets that have absolutely no flight path line from a drive? Take 1,000 foot holes out of the equation. But holes within reach of a drive but with absolutely no way to get to them baring some lucky freak of nature shot.

 

[billnchristy]

Agree- blind holes rock
Agree- blind holes with no pin position indicated stink

That was one of my only gashes about Rankin Lake in Gastonia, the back 9 has no signs and multiple blind multi position pins. Walking over a hill and looking around every hole stinks....most of the time I just rip it because it rare that I make it all the way to the pin anyways.

 

[bikinjack]

One of my pet peeves here is people who put blind baskets as a con in their reviews since it made their first time through more difficult and less fun. That is a bogus con! Courses are not designed for drive-by reviewers, but for people who will play the course repeatedly.

Blind basket locations almost always make the course better since they add skill and they add a little excitement/anticipation/trepidation once your disc is in the air. IMO, that adds to the fun-factor.

On the flip side, holes with multiple blind pins that do not have maps showing the current position of the basket is a legit con. It is legit since locals/regulars will repeatedly have to walk down the fairway to scope things out to see where the basket is today.

I'm thinking about holes 11 & 12 at Hornet's Nest Original as I read this. Good stuff as always.

 

[prerube]

One of my pet peeves here is people who put blind baskets as a con in their reviews since it made their first time through more difficult and less fun. That is a bogus con! Courses are not designed for drive-by reviewers, but for people who will play the course repeatedly.

Blind basket locations almost always make the course better since they add skill and they add a little excitement/anticipation/trepidation once your disc is in the air. IMO, that adds to the fun-factor.

On the flip side, holes with multiple blind pins that do not have maps showing the current position of the basket is a legit con. It is legit since locals/regulars will repeatedly have to walk down the fairway to scope things out to see where the basket is today.

Blind baskets will happen if there are obsticles, but when 11 out of 18 are blind and their is no signage, then I have a problem. Blind baskets are only a problem when their is poor signage.

 

[Dave242]

What do you think about baskets that have absolutely no flight path line from a drive? ....holes within reach of a drive but with absolutely no way to get to them baring some lucky freak of nature shot.

Short answer: plinko holes are bad holes.

Long answer: Golf should reward skill and punish bad execution (and bad choices). A big part of skill is consistent accuracy, so if the course is designed for highly skilled players narrow/challenging routes reward skill. But, for less skilled players making it to the basket is more a matter of luck than skill.

For example, a 220' wooded hole with 6' pinch-point at 100' is a good challenge and test of skill for a Blue level (940-ish) or Gold level (990-ish) player. But that gap is too narrow to separate the more skilled from the less skilled player that is rated below 900 (almost all players who have been playing less than 1-2 years). Since their "spray pattern" is much wider, hitting a narrow gap is just random luck, not skill.

 

[crawdad62]

Most of the time you're reading the review of a course because you've never played there. You're trying to get a sense of the course and whether or not you should even trouble yourself to go play it. I think completely blind holes should at least be addressed. Maybe not a con for the course but certainly it can be if you're not really sure where you're going half the time.

I see what you mean. Of course a blind hole makes it somewhat more challenging to people that play the course regularly. But it also needs to be addressed in a review (especially without proper signage) since it more than likely the person that's checking out the review is probably never played the course. That's the whole reason they're checking it out.

 

[whitechocolate]

I think blind baskets is what helps makes a great course great. I think courses where all 18 pins at straight off the tee are well worse than than if a course had 18 blind holes. Although, I have never, ever seen the latter.

Variety is the spice of life. Sure it makes initial play on a course more difficult, but once you play it once you are good to go. I dont go out to a new course to shoot my best round ever (UofW Whitewater aside), I go for new opportunties. If I bogey a few holes throwing at the wrong basket, or down the wrong line, that's disc golf. That is what makes it great.

 

[prerube]

Courses are not designed for drive-by reviewers, but for people who will play the course repeatedly.

but reviews are written for drive-by players

 

[crawdad62]

but reviews are written for drive-by players

I think that's the crux of the topic. Nobody is debating whether or not blind holes are good holes or not but whether the reviewer should ding a course because of them.

 

[Dave242]

Blind baskets will happen if there are obsticles, but when 11 out of 18 are blind and their is no signage, then I have a problem. Blind baskets are only a problem when their is poor signage.

Granted, signs are better no signs. But......this is the exact sentiment that is my pet peeve (assuming you are talking about holes with only one basket location). Yes, it is a hassle the first time through, but after that you have it figured out and the issue goes away. IMO, this should not be a reason to mark down the rating of a course.

 

[prerube]

I think we all agree that if ou can see every basket, then there is probably not alot of challenge, but I have to go with BillnChristy

Walking over a hill and looking around every hole stinks

When I waste my time looking for blind hole after blind hole and don't know where the basket is until the 3rd throw, I am going to tear that course a new one. If it takes me 3 1/2 hours to play a course because of poor signage and blind holes it is a con. You mark the course down because of the lack of signage, not the blind holes.

a course with great signs, but numerous blind holes can easily get a 5 still.

 

[bikinjack]

Agree- blind holes rock
Agree- blind holes with no pin position indicated stink

That was one of my only gashes about Rankin Lake in Gastonia, the back 9 has no signs and multiple blind multi position pins. Walking over a hill and looking around every hole stinks....most of the time I just rip it because it rare that I make it all the way to the pin anyways.

We're working on the signs. Seriously. Hopefully they'll be in soon. Next time your up this way to play hit me up & I'll try to join you.

As far as the multi positions, is there a good way to indicate on this site which position they're in. I'm a noob at this, and if I knew how I would keep it updated for Rankin. I know that's not a definitive solution, but it couldn't hurt. I know you can update the hole info section, but that doesn't explicitly say long position or short position, and I don't think you can see the other distances without hitting the "update info" tab.

 

[prerube]

As far as the multi positions, is there a good way to indicate on this site which position they're in. .

I have seen courses with pegs pushed into holes on the sign pole. Hole 1 means it is in the A position, 2 is the B position. I think Quaker in PA uses this system.

 

[Roc1Time]

I have seen courses with pegs pushed into holes on the sign pole. Hole 1 means it is in the A position, 2 is the B position. I think Quaker in PA uses this system.

Edmond ok has that on the main board on hle 1, very cool because there are some hols that you need to know that. Blind holes are ok as long as you have an idea of them before you go out. Nothing is worse then reading reviews or course descriptions and it seems easy to follow and then you get there and its like your playing a totally different course

 

[WillA]

Blind baskets do NOT add skill in my opinion. How can they? You can't see the target so you don't know what line to take. If you get close it is either luck or because you have played the course enough that you know where the basket is.

 

[billnchristy]

Tuscawilla park in Daytona had a round washer bolted on with a number indicating pin position. If you only have 2 you can paint a color or number on each side, if you have more than one a couple washers will do it.

 

[Roc1Time]

Just because you cant see the basket doesnt mean you cant see the "line".

 

[Apothecary]

Just because you cant see the basket doesnt mean you cant see the "line".

word. the blind pin positions are great imho. dinging courses because of them alone seems like a drive by reviewer move. if you have a bad time at the course, spent looking for signs and climbing hills looking for the pin, seems to me it is symptomatic of not knowing the course well enough to review it.

 

[solomon.trenton]

One of my pet peeves here is people who put blind baskets as a con in their reviews since it made their first time through more difficult and less fun. That is a bogus con! Courses are not designed for drive-by reviewers, but for people who will play the course repeatedly.

Blind basket locations almost always make the course better since they add skill and they add a little excitement/anticipation/trepidation once your disc is in the air. IMO, that adds to the fun-factor.

On the flip side, holes with multiple blind pins that do not have maps showing the current position of the basket is a legit con. It is legit since locals/regulars will repeatedly have to walk down the fairway to scope things out to see where the basket is today.

almost agreed. i have no problem with blind baskets, but i would like a tee sign that points you in the right way or a clearly shown fairway. the other thing that sucks is when you can see multiole unnumbered baskets from a tee