The Disc Golf "Grand Slam"

[SonicGuy]

Ball golf doesn't really do it that way. The US Open is held at different sites every year, but is still a major.

And I prefer the Tennis style

It really bugs me that the US open moves around. It means that the golfer that won the US open didn't really win anything of historical significance. It was a one off tournament with some strong branding.

The only exception is with Open Championship. All of those courses have the same feel.

 

[Gmtata01]

World Grandslam:
Aussie Open
USDGC
European Open
Japan Open

USA GrandSlam:
Worlds
USDGC
DGPT Championship
Hall of Fame Classic

 

[Streets]

NT's, Worlds, USDGC. Like what Paul did a few years back. Maybe add in the DGPT Championship as well.

 

[TimSyl]

And I prefer the Tennis style

It really bugs me that the US open moves around. It means that the golfer that won the US open didn't really win anything of historical significance. It was a one off tournament with some strong branding.

The only exception is with Open Championship. All of those courses have the same feel.

Other than most being links style courses, they are actually very different. (I've played three of them).

 

[DavidSauls]

Different tastes for everyone, but for myself, any Grand Slam that doesn't include the most prestigious tournament (Worlds) would not be a very Grand Slam.

 

[lyleoross]

I'm gonna agree with Sonic, I dislike Worlds as a Grand Slam. Part of the problem is that there is so much variation in hole structure and other factors. It is fully modifiable. Some day, when like ball golf, courses are set and played as is, then maybe, but right now there is too much variation.

I hate Memorial. Yep, it is storied and etc. but it is also a butt ugly venue, in terms of disc golf. Even Las Vegas and GBO are better. And no, I'm not talking about quality of event, and effort by staff. I'm simply talking watching guys throw discs on big open fields with one or two trees, ropes, and water. There are venues that allow big throws that are just better, see Jonesboro and SFO.



Venues drive me. You can build a world class event with time.

Milo
De La
Green Mountain
Maple Hill
EO
USDGC - barely, the venue is maverage, but the overall location is quite nice and it shows what staff can do with an average location
Appling
Jonesboro
The new site at San Francisco - best ball golf setting I've seen
Pittsburg, Nox


There are other sites where I've seen events on that are considered top notch, Throw Down the Mountain being one.

If we're gonna build world class events into a grand slam, then we should build them at world class locations. I guess one factor would have to be viewing. Some of the courses I listed just don't accomodate fans all that well.

 

[DavidSauls]

I don't know if we can build a Grand Slam. It may need to evolve as a few events rise about the others.

To me, a Grand Slam of less-than-top-events is sort of like the NT---a second-tier accomplishment.

 

[SonicGuy]

I can't believe that I missed on USDGC, obviously that would be my East coast leg.

As for the memorial, yes the courses suck, but there is a bar off of both main courses and plenty of space for good stuff like flymarts and clinics. And the traditional ball golf round is a plus too. IDK, maybe I am just sentimental.

 

[lyleoross]

I don't know if we can build a Grand Slam. It may need to evolve as a few events rise about the others.

To me, a Grand Slam of less-than-top-events is sort of like the NT---a second-tier accomplishment.

I'm pretty confident that this is how it will happen. Eventually, the PDGA will do the political thing and pull in a set for marketing purposes. But we are in a unique position where we could do what we want.

If you go with your model then it seems:

De La
USDGC
Worlds

Maybe:
EO
Memorial
Beaver State

 

[SonicGuy]

What we really need is four privately owned courses to hold non-pdga tournaments. That would be really cool.

 

[roggenb3]

What we really need is four privately owned courses to hold non-pdga tournaments. That would be really cool.

BRP, VQ, HBH, RR

Midwest non-pdga grand slam

 

[DavidSauls]

What titles are people most remembered for? Right now it's Worlds and USDGC---more people remember who has won these, and how many times they've won them, than any other events?

What's next after them?

I don't know, myself; I don't pay attention that closely. The Memorial, warts and all?---it at least has a Daytona 500 season kickoff aspect. European Open? The DGPT is still being built; perhaps it will rise to that status. It's certainly trying. Or perhaps someone will create something new, a big match-play tournament or something, that will do it.

In the meantime, it doesn't have to be a Grand Slam. It could be a Triple Crown, if just one more event rises up.

 

[lyleoross]

What titles are people most remembered for? Right now it's Worlds and USDGC---more people remember who has won these, and how many times they've won them, than any other events?

What's next after them?

I don't know, myself; I don't pay attention that closely. The Memorial, warts and all?---it at least has a Daytona 500 season kickoff aspect. European Open? The DGPT is still being built; perhaps it will rise to that status. It's certainly trying. Or perhaps someone will create something new, a big match-play tournament or something, that will do it.

In the meantime, it doesn't have to be a Grand Slam. It could be a Triple Crown, if just one more event rises up.

I knew about De La long before USDGC. I agree, people don't view the winners in quite the same way, but it has the history.

I might know who won worlds, but for the most part, I have trouble remembering where it happened if it wasn't Beaver State, Penn... Um, I know it happened in Kansas, was that last year?

 

[JC17393]

I don't know if we can build a Grand Slam. It may need to evolve as a few events rise about the others.

This, this, 1000 times this.

Ball golf's "grand slam" evolved into what it is today. The original "grand slam" was invented by Bobby Jones just because it represented the four titles he wanted to try to earn all in one year: US Open, US Amateur, British Open, British Amateur. Then it became about the pros only, so the two amateur tournaments dropped out and the Masters (the only one held in the same place every year) was added. Then once the PGA Tour was created, the PGA Championship became the fourth.

We're probably still at the stage pre-PGA Tour where there are two clear cut "majors" (Worlds, USDGC) and then a whole bunch that could make the cut to be the third and fourth eventually.

Frankly, I think one of the criteria for being a "major" in Grand Slam ball golf style is that one must earn their way into the event. It can't be a tournament you can just hang out online at the right time and get yourself into. USDGC fits the bill as requiring players to qualify at a satellite event (or the day before). Open Worlds had a points requirement that could be easily brought back, so that fits too. Maybe the DGPT Championships fits as a third at this point since you have to earn DGPT points to get in. No other tournament on the DGPT or NT has minimum criteria. If there's an open spot, anyone can fill it.

 

[DavidSauls]

I just think that's the formula---which ones are remembered the most, or revered the most, or coveted the most by the players (beyond just money).

Everything else---best or worst courses, moving around or established in one place, formats, payouts (unless a payout rises so high to gain that attention, and stays there)---won't make Grand Slam (or Triple Crown) catch on.

Anything else, and people will say "This guy won the grand slam, but that guy won Worlds!". Sort of like the NT now; you could argue that winning the NT points is a more significant accomplishment than Worlds, with more rounds and more variety of courses. But I don't think it's gained quite that reputation.

 

[lyleoross]

This, this, 1000 times this.

Ball golf's "grand slam" evolved into what it is today. The original "grand slam" was invented by Bobby Jones just because it represented the four titles he wanted to try to earn all in one year: US Open, US Amateur, British Open, British Amateur. Then it became about the pros only, so the two amateur tournaments dropped out and the Masters (the only one held in the same place every year) was added. Then once the PGA Tour was created, the PGA Championship became the fourth.

We're probably still at the stage pre-PGA Tour where there are two clear cut "majors" (Worlds, USDGC) and then a whole bunch that could make the cut to be the third and fourth eventually.

Frankly, I think one of the criteria for being a "major" in Grand Slam ball golf style is that one must earn their way into the event. It can't be a tournament you can just hang out online at the right time and get yourself into. USDGC fits the bill as requiring players to qualify at a satellite event (or the day before). Open Worlds had a points requirement that could be easily brought back, so that fits too. Maybe the DGPT Championships fits as a third at this point since you have to earn DGPT points to get in. No other tournament on the DGPT or NT has minimum criteria. If there's an open spot, anyone can fill it.

While it is correct that these events evolved, we are in a very different world today. Yeah, we could wait till something evolved, or we could build something based on criteria. The organic way things happen isn't always the best way to chose important outcomes.

 

[JTacoma03]

I am reviving this thread and now updating it, given the changes in disc golf since I started it.

TODAY I would say four events --

The Memorial
Pro Worlds
USDGC
DGPT Championship

I like the feel of a grand slam encompassing four slightly different kinds of events.

If this is just a hypothetical exercise, i.e. "reconstructing the dream Grand Slam run", ignore what I'm about to say.


A Grand Slam means you win all of the Majors in any sport. We have that already, and it typically needs to be 4 events (or more), thus the name.

Paul McBeth did this in 2015, and there were 5 majors that year (Aussie Open, Scandanavian Open, European Open, Worlds, USDGC).

There are only 3 majors this year (you can ignore the Am and age protected, I have no idea why PDGA insists on labeling them as Majors) so this would be a weak year if someone sweeps.

 

[ThrowBot]

A Grand Slam means you win all of the Majors in any sport. We have that already...

Agree.

The real DISCussion, imo, is what tournaments could/should be "Majors". Once the Majors are selected, then the composition of the Grand Slam is set. However, the PDGA has not always selected Majors based solely on a tournament's historical prestige. Heck, there isn't even a standard number of MPO Majors from year to year. I don't personally think a specific quantity is "required" to constitute a Grand Slam, but the number should at least be consistent year to year!

So I guess I see the motivation why some would try to cherry pick which tournaments "should" constitute the Grand Slam of disc golf. But, as long as you're doing that without regards to the Majors, you're approaching the issue from the wrong end.

 

[DavidSauls]

Agree.

The real DISCussion, imo, is what tournaments could/should be "Majors". Once the Majors are selected, then the composition of the Grand Slam is set. However, the PDGA has not always selected Majors based solely on a tournament's historical prestige. Heck, there isn't even a standard number of MPO Majors from year to year. I don't personally think a specific quantity is "required" to constitute a Grand Slam, but the number should at least be consistent year to year!

So I guess I see the motivation why some would try to cherry pick which tournaments "should" constitute the Grand Slam of disc golf. But, as long as you're doing that without regards to the Majors, you're approaching the issue from the wrong end.

Well said.

The PDGA uses the term "Major" in a slightly different way than, say, golf, or even common usage of the word. It may be the biggest event in a classification (doubles, ams, geezers, etc.), or on a continent. And perhaps one or two that are more "major" in name than anything else.

 

[DavidSauls]

....I've been musing for years that, one day, the PDGA will introduce the term "Super Major", for those top events, to distinguish from the "Mere Majors".