biscoe
* Ace Member *
I feel so insecure all of a sudden... where is my binky?
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The Inevitable 2017 Pros Switching Sponsors Thread
- Thread starter Aim For The Chains
- Start date
I feel so insecure all of a sudden... where is my binky?
Hampstead
* Ace Member *
I wasn't picked on in HS and have no chips to carry. Innova did what they felt they needed to, but I don't support it.
Can I just add that "butthurt" has to be among the most idiotic phrases in current use?
Can I just add that "butthurt" has to be among the most idiotic phrases in current use?
I disagree. Companies should distance themselves from those who shed bad light on the brand, not police morals. There's no objective morality in the world - this discussion regarding a very minimal incident serves as a testament to that.
I really, really hesitate to bring up this comparison because I'm worried some (not you) will be unable to handle the discussion that follows, but compare this to Anthon.
I think in each case, for my tastes, they've reacted appropriately to the situation.
Too general of a statement. I can bring up plenty of counter examples. Josh Gordon, Johnny Manziel, etc. (coincidentally both were from the same franchise) People get multiple chances when the situation warrants. In my eyes this particular instance just isn't that serious.
No, not at all. Patrick was offered more to throw for Latitude. Similar to Gibson/DD.
slowplastic
* Ace Member *
- Joined
- Jul 11, 2014
- Messages
- 6,254
So if someone throws their monitor across their cubicle and then bumps through a line of their co-workers in the office, management should just turn a blind eye and not do any "policing"?
Baahahaha
biscoe
* Ace Member *
OK- I give you the semantic difference between policing actual morality and policing perceived morality.
I do believe however that the latter is in the best interest of most companies.BW has a history of offenses as long as your arm. Most did not make it to the PDGA for one reason or another. A week or 2 after Ledgestone he was here telling the gallery "f*ck this place and f*ck all the people here" at The Blockhouse of all places. By not kicking him to the curb Innova is enabling his behavior. As you say the comparison is not a good one but Josh is probably more likely to actually reform.
Dcinmd
Double Eagle Member
Upper management does that all of the time, sometimes even with a promotion. It is amazing to me that people act like there are not atleast two sets of rules. Producers or high performers will always get a longer leash.
I am not saying that is right or the way it should be, just acknowledging the world we live in.
slowplastic
* Ace Member *
- Joined
- Jul 11, 2014
- Messages
- 6,254
That's true, some first world country just elected a bully to run it.
SD86
Banned
Which is better than electing a corrupt traitor.
Hampstead
* Ace Member *
For the love of CE, please leave politics out of this. I think we've all had enough of that shizzz.
lyleoross
* Ace Member *
Huh?
I could see IT getting away with that.
The irony here is stronger than BW's basket kicks.
lyleoross
* Ace Member *
We have three distinct types of behavior from Mr. Williams. Drinking at an event. This is simply a rules breaking. Honestly, stupid but not that horrific. Kicking over a basket in frustration or property damage. Rules breaking of a higher order. Double dumb and churlish, but mostly, a complaint directed at something other than a person. The third is what I have a problem with. At Ledgstone BW went after a player on his card, not because that player did something wrong, but because BW was having a bad round and needed to take it out on someone else. Then in the next round, after BW sucked it up on a single hole, he took it out on a second player, who then filed a complaint.
Let's look for a moment at Nikko, who commenters often give as a comparison. Nikko has blow ups too and for the same reasons. His blow ups are always, always directed at himself. BWs blow ups, at least in this case, are directed at someone else. That is the point where BW lost my support. It takes a particularly small person to go after someone else when things are bad for themselves. Dirty, you can call me a whimp for thinking BW is a donkey for lacking the balls to look in the mirror when his play vacuums. That he is such a pussy cat that he will attack another player because he isn't man enough to give credit for his lousy play to himself.
I'm not a fan of the whole safe space thing. Life is full of jerks and dealing with them is a necessary skill. But it is typically my observation that the guys we create safe spaces for are guys like BW who've acted like jerks. Oh look, he's a donkey, let's all be careful not to hurt his feelings.
Now, I've defended BW in the past, but he seems unrepentant in his behavior and unapologetic about acting like a turd. Oh wait, all you "bullied" people, you need to take care of poor BW or you're whimps. No we don't, at least not until he deals with his problems.
Let's look for a moment at Nikko, who commenters often give as a comparison. Nikko has blow ups too and for the same reasons. His blow ups are always, always directed at himself. BWs blow ups, at least in this case, are directed at someone else. That is the point where BW lost my support. It takes a particularly small person to go after someone else when things are bad for themselves. Dirty, you can call me a whimp for thinking BW is a donkey for lacking the balls to look in the mirror when his play vacuums. That he is such a pussy cat that he will attack another player because he isn't man enough to give credit for his lousy play to himself.
I'm not a fan of the whole safe space thing. Life is full of jerks and dealing with them is a necessary skill. But it is typically my observation that the guys we create safe spaces for are guys like BW who've acted like jerks. Oh look, he's a donkey, let's all be careful not to hurt his feelings.
Now, I've defended BW in the past, but he seems unrepentant in his behavior and unapologetic about acting like a turd. Oh wait, all you "bullied" people, you need to take care of poor BW or you're whimps. No we don't, at least not until he deals with his problems.
tbird888
Salient Disc Test Team
Maybe if they write COBOL.
tbird888
Salient Disc Test Team
To Lyle's point, the severity of BW's violations continue to increase. I feel like too many people are looking at his latest problem as an isolated incident.
And to those defending his actions by attacking the people speaking out, if you think threatening another player on your card is nothing to be concerned about, you might want to look into some anger management classes. Stay home and threaten yourselves until you learn to respect others. Throwing frisbees is supposed to be fun, even when it's frustrating.
And to those defending his actions by attacking the people speaking out, if you think threatening another player on your card is nothing to be concerned about, you might want to look into some anger management classes. Stay home and threaten yourselves until you learn to respect others. Throwing frisbees is supposed to be fun, even when it's frustrating.
lyleoross
* Ace Member *
SD86
Banned
What irony? I said nothing ironic. I've had a Top Secret clearance, and never violated nor betrayed it... unlike the loser of that First World country election.
OK- I give you the semantic difference between policing actual morality and policing perceived morality.
BW has a history of offenses as long as your arm. Most did not make it to the PDGA for one reason or another. A week or 2 after Ledgestone he was here telling the gallery "f*ck this place and f*ck all the people here" at The Blockhouse of all places. By not kicking him to the curb Innova is enabling his behavior. As you say the comparison is not a good one but Josh is probably more likely to actually reform.
Sure, it's no secret that this isn't his first behavioral issue. I'm just trying to think from a company standpoint - it's a potentially unstable precedent to set if you don't "wipe the slate" when you sign someone. Remember that he wasn't brought onto Innova's team until midway through the season, which is why I believe they are handling it properly.
We all know the "Texas Cactus" nickname, but to a certain degree - if you believe enough in somebody to sponsor them (especially mid season), you have to believe in them enough to count day 1 as a sponsored player as their fresh start. If you contextualize it that way, this was his first infraction on record with the PDGA right?
I do think you have valid points, don't get me wrong. Remember though that it's not like he's getting off easy. What's the #1 complaint of most sponsored players? Not enough support from sponsors. He's not getting bonuses, entry fees refunded, etc. He's just getting discs to help maintain his skill level while he serves his suspension. His ability to grow his brand and compete (and keep sharp) has been significantly dented.
Under this, he also would be foolish to seek other sponsorship, because then there's no way Innova takes him back. So I think there's more strategy here than it seems on the surface.
onemilemore
* Ace Member *
I mean, you don't generally see sports teams cut ties with players over suspensions for on-field incidents. Off-field? Sure. However, you will see sponsors drop players of major sports for various transgressions. Which leaves us with this: Is Innova, in this situation, a team, or a sponsor? With disc golf's current structure, I'd say it's a pretty gray area and you could make arguments for both.
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