In general I don't like OB, but OB in the woods is particularly dumb. I also like my frisbees and so I don't see the water and swamps as positives. A few neat holes, but also some goofy designs on other holes. VQ looks neat, but the actual experience of throwing discs at VQ I find overall not fun and I don't think it makes for good disc golf.
I agree and disagree with you at the same time.
Agree - I hate losing discs as well, and in most cases, if your disc goes in the water, you are not getting it back. Obviously the water pits were dug deep enough so the water level stays consistent, but that means no retrieving discs unless you are right off the shoreline. I also agree that many of the holes seem unique to VQ in comparison to most other courses, especially in Minnesota, and only in the middle holes from 6 to 13 does it feel like traditional disc golf. You go from gimmicky to regular back to gimmicky to finish out the round, and it almost feels like playing too different courses; you definitely have to use two different mindsets.
Disagree - Those traditional holes, from 6-13, make the rest of the course viable, and it is those holes with unique challenges that I feel are great for the sport in general. The biggest complaint I have seen out of professional courses played for the biggest tournaments are that they are long and open, not only to challenge the big arms into throwing as far as they can as accurately as they can, but so that they are easy to film. Tight, technical courses are a nightmare to film, and I am sure pros hate to hit trees even more so than ams (because we do it so often already). And yet, open, long, and or open long holes with hazards are legitimate challenges because this sport should not be solely about hitting tight lines in the woods. You should know how to hit tight landing zones when you have to deal with wind and or elevation changes. Sometimes, and I think this is where the gripe about VQ comes from, is that it is more difficult to hitting small landing zones when you do not have obstacles to frame your needed line.
If the whole course was like Holes 3-5 and 14-18, I can understand everyone being frustrated, but in reality it is less than half the course. How often do you find all the possible challenges we can face when throwing in one round? I do not blame VQ, in fact welcome it, because most Minnesota courses lack elevation and related hazards. Look at BRP - they had to manufacture high tee boxes to get any elevation. And other courses like Kaposia, Kenwood, The Valley, and to a lesser extend Bryant and Lakewood, have so little elevation that the one or two holes where they have something, they are considered marquee holes.
Recently I have been spoiled by playing a lot of Wisconsin, Iowa, Michigan, and Illinois courses, and those courses put most of our Minnesota courses to shame simply because they luckily and naturally have elevation that can be incorporated into open and wooded holes to the point where the whole course is filled with marquee holes, not just one or two. The closest thing I can think of in Minnesota would be the two courses in Mora.
Then again, to be fair, of all the times I have played VQ, I have walked away only losing one disc. If anything, I look forward to playing Hole 3 because I am dead-set on hitting that gap (I am 50/50), 15 because my Verdict is the perfect disc for that island and I have struck metal three times now, and 18 because at my power level I have little trouble making it across and in a position to get a routine three. Do not get me wrong, I have been OB more times I can count, but I am willing to admit that walking away without losing discs does help to not sour my opinion of the course.