Is the hole too dangerous or my paranoia?

[Seabrook]

I am struggling with my paranoia. The city has asked me to design our 1st disc golf course. The 1st 9 holes were completed a year ago and its been a huge success. The first 9 holes goes through an open area which allowed us to design a beginner/intermediate friendly course. Very limitted safety concerns for the 1st 9 holes.

Now the city wants me to design the 2nd nine, however my first hole on the new side scares me. The first hole on the new side is 510 feet down a 40' wide straight grassy area with heavy tree coverage on either side and a path running down one side of this open strip. Players will be hucking parallel to the path and I would expect that most drives will have to thrown down the path. The view is copletely open so you can see anyone walking on the path.

I have suggested a bench at the tee to sit and wait for pedestrians to walk past along with signage to warn not to throw when someone is in front of you. However I am worried some idiot will be impatient, try to force their throw and hit someone.

I've asked a few local golfers and they like the hole. The city thinks its okay as you can see anyone walking. However I am worried if someone gets hit it will blow-up and cause big problems for the course (posible removal?). Especially since it is the first in the city if we loose the course there is no back-up to go play.

Should I listen to everyone else or should I pull the hole and find another location which will definitely not be as nice?

 

[riltim]

Pull it. Some idiot will throw while pedestrians are walking on path regardless of signage.

 

[Jukeshoe]

I am struggling with my paranoia. The city has asked me to design our 1st disc golf course. The 1st 9 holes were completed a year ago and its been a huge success. The first 9 holes goes through an open area which allowed us to design a beginner/intermediate friendly course. Very limitted safety concerns for the 1st 9 holes.

Now the city wants me to design the 2nd nine, however my first hole on the new side scares me. The first hole on the new side is 510 feet down a 40' wide straight grassy area with heavy tree coverage on either side and a path running down one side of this open strip. Players will be hucking parallel to the path and I would expect that most drives will have to thrown down the path. The view is copletely open so you can see anyone walking on the path.

I have suggested a bench at the tee to sit and wait for pedestrians to walk past along with signage to warn not to throw when someone is in front of you. However I am worried some idiot will be impatient, try to force their throw and hit someone.

I've asked a few local golfers and they like the hole. The city thinks its okay as you can see anyone walking. However I am worried if someone gets hit it will blow-up and cause big problems for the course (posible removal?). Especially since it is the first in the city if we loose the course there is no back-up to go play.

Should I listen to everyone else or should I pull the hole and find another location which will definitely not be as nice?

Difficult to get an accurate image from description alone...any chance of a picture?

My initial (site unseen) opinion would be that it's fine.

 

[DavidSauls]

How much is the walking path used?

My initial response would be "don't do it!" But our local course had walking paths installed years after the course---with no consideration or even input from the disc golfers. If you looked at it, you'd say it's crazy dangerous. In fact, the walking paths are a bit of government folly, and almost never used. It's now been about 5 years and I haven't heard of anyone being hit yet.

 

[scarpfish]

any chance of a picture?

^ This.

I'm glad the OP is giving consideration to this. Holes we designed and got away with 20 years ago, some of which have grown into being dangerous, we really shouldn't be getting away with anymore, considering we now know what can happen.

The amount of traffic that path gets is going to be a major factor.

 

[chevis]

yeah, it really depends on how much the path is used. there is a course here with a path that goes across quite a few fairways, but it is hardly used, so there hasn't been an issue that i've ever heard of.

 

[Seabrook]

 

[Stardoggy]

That's a pretty clear sight line. I'd say put a sign up at the tee pad, and maybe put a sign up on both ends of the hole on the path, letting users of the path know there's a disc golf hole there, and high speed frisbees may be flying around.

 

[Cgkdisc]

Looks like you're going to have to cut some holes through the woods anyway. I would look at designing maybe a few holes that diagonally cut across the walkway where the tees are close to the walkway so very little of the walkway is exposed. I would also go up rather than down in that area which minimizes the possibility of a downward shank that traverses the path.

 

[hipster]

To avoid potential disaster, I would move the fairway inside the woodsl to the left and still put up the signage.

 

[46YearOldSlinger]

Picture helps a lot. How used/crowded is the path? If it's well used it may create a bottleneck while everyone waits on pedestrians. If it's low traffic/usually clear you'll probably be okay. Make sure to observe traffic patterns on different day and different times of day. Just my 2 cents...

 

[mashnut]

Also, no matter how much signage you put up, expect chuckers to come along and ignore it. It looks in the picture like folks on the path will be able to see it coming if when that happens, as long as that's true then it's at least less likely you'll end up with an angry soccer mom suing the city after some idiot hits her in the head with a boss.

 

[notroman]

Yep, mashnut hit the nail on the head. You can install signs, flashing lights, cameras, whatever you want. There will still be people throwing down the path while pedestrians are on it. Someone will get hit. Considering this is a longer hole that means you run into an even greater risk of someone losing control of their drive trying to rip it harder than they should. I have yet to play a course that has walking trails in play with signs posted where people don't throw on pedestrians.

 

[sisyphus]

I'd go with two shorter, technical holes teeing from the path itself, over a dangerous longer hole any day. Saves on tee expenses, but adds some work in the woods to prepare. But you can add variety as well: shape one into the woods right, then come back to at least within view of the finishing line you've got.

Then again, I personally enjoy a technical 260 footer over a 500' bomber I don't have in my arsenal.

 

[riltim]

How much the walking path is used is not relevant; it's not safe if it's used 100 times an hour or 1 time every 3 hours. You are setting up a hole where the disc will be thrown directly over an area where pedestrians travel.

 

[BirdieMachine]

I would put two shorter 250-270 foot holes in. Teeboxes using the path and throwing towards and into the woods on the left, or if you got funds put the boxes next to the path. Just better be safe then sorry and having an incident get the whole thing pulled.

 

[hoppedup]

Looks like this is a ~400 acre park that is 95% wooded. I'd say move the hole if you can.

It looks like it would be easy enough to see people and avoid hitting them, though. My local course has a walking path in play on roughly half the holes and I've never thrown anywhere near a pedestrian.

 

[biscoe]

If you have to ask you probably already know the answer.

 

[BrotherDave]

Wow, this reminds me of hole 7 at Rotary Club DGC a lot. Designed by Mr. Innova Russel Schwarz himself, this plays kind of reverse to what you're proposing, with a busy as hell jogging trail on the left and finishes into the woods on the right. 534'.

If it's okay with Schwarz, it's okay for you. :| Your hole actually looks a lot safer.

I'd ask myself: Is this a good hole to begin with? Do the design characteristics give the course something that outweighs these potential safety issues? Because if it's a ho-hum hole anyway, there's no point arguing. If you can make holes just as good into the woods to avoid this path, then go for it.

 

[Timeetyo]

How much the walking path is used is not relevant; it's not safe if it's used 100 times an hour or 1 time every 3 hours. You are setting up a hole where the disc will be thrown directly over an area where pedestrians travel.

I disagree with this. If we removed every DG hole where a pedestrian may walk across a fairway 1x every 3 hours, there'd be WAY too few courses out there.

But that's not to say we shouldn't take a long hard look at installing a hole like this. The way I view it is EVERY hole is a RISK/REWARD valuation attached to it:
- How dangerous is the hole currently? Is that likely to become more/less dangerous over time?
- How important is that hole to the course? Are there other alternatives? How much of a trade-off is required for a more safe approach? Do you drop a hole from a 10/10 hole to a 9/10 hole for significantly less risk? Yes. Do you drop a hole from a 10/10 hole to a 2/10 filler hole for a tiny bit less risk...maybe not.

Now I'm not saying designing a hole that throws over a playground is ok because it makes a sweet hole. I am just saying we need to look at the potential risk and balance that against the reward (including what it'd be like w/ an alternative) to make choices. Otherwise - to eliminate all risk - we'd basically have no holes within 500' of any road, walking path, etc. That's just silly - so find the right balance somewhere in the middle.