What about a new pro division?

[Halcón]

If Rec/Int caliber players want to play Open as an expensive lesson in hopes the experience may make them a better player down the road, I don't see what business that is to message board idealists who have no skin in the game.

You're right Scarp. Everyone playing up is there for the experience.

 

[Star Shark]

Here in LA, we have the opposite problem. Our Open division pool is fairly deep, including some 'Super Pros'. Because of that alot of Adv guys don't want to move up and just give their money to Rico, Rathwaite, Mcbeth or the several others who are here. This also creates clogging in the lower divisions. You need to shoot about 970 rated to win Int around here.

 

[Central Scrutinizer]

I played in a tournament in 1990 with 5 people in it. One division.

 

[DavidSauls]

I've had an idea for a few years, but I haven't brought it up before. However, the more I think about it, the more it makes sense. (At least here locally.) And keep in mind, this is just for Men's, not masters, grandmasters, women, etc...

First, change the rating guidelines and do away with the whole Adv, Int, Rec definitions.

MPO: 975+
MA1: 950-974
MA2: 925-949
MA3: 900-924
MA4: Anything 899 and under

The smaller, 25 point gaps I feel would help level the playing field and group those closer in skill levels. But here's the catch. With what your rating is, you HAVE to play in that division. Sometimes I think that allowing people to play in a division that they don't belong in is problematic. I compare it to baseball. In order to get to the majors, you have to be at a certain skill level, hence the rating of at least 975 to play MPO. In baseball, if a player can't hack it in AAA, they get sent down to AA. This would essentially make people work for it more. If you wanna play in MA1 but you're rating is 930, well then hit the practice field. Granted, in order to imagine a system such as this, you would have to view it as if you had no previous knowledge of how the system is set up currently.

Ok now interwebbers, feel free to shoot my idea full of holes and crush my hopes and dreams!!

Not that it couldn't work, but several drawbacks to consider:

* Forcing someone to go Pro would hurt people keeping their Am status long enough to play AmWorlds. Especially if it happened at the last update.

* Forcing people into divisions means giving people less choice, which is likely to reduce total participation.

* Small ratings spreads would make it easier to compete and win, but would also make divisions smaller. Playing in a small division, with the same card all 4 rounds, isn't much fun for a lot of us.

* What happens when only 2 people whos up for MA2?

* You'd have players constantly bouncing between divisions. Tough on state series.

* Big range between 830 and 899. (As an 897-rated player, this doesn't really appeal to me that much. Fortunately I can take refuge in age-based divisions).

What is the benefit of forcing someone to play down in his correct division? Other than keeping him from griping that the properly-positioned players are "baggers"?

 

[Chainsgoching]

You should be able to come for the experience while still being able to compete well and possibly win. As a 900 rated player, I play MA2. Im always competitive in my division but have only won once and have had a ton of 2nd-5th finishes. I feel my skillset is that of a 930-950 golfer but I struggle with inconsistencies in my tournament game, hence the 900 rating.

Anytime I have played MA1, I always end up in the bottom 5, AKA the donators club. I believe that there are a lot of golfers in the same boat as well. I have played many tournament rounds with golfers around the same skillset, that also struggle with being consistent. We are pretty good disc golfers but have a hard time getting everything to work well on any given day. Maybe we need to practice more, I dont know, but my problems usually skip around. Over a short period of time it may be putting, approaches or off the tee, but there always seems to be a weakness in my game, somewhere along the line. When I play a tournament, I want to play to win and have a driving force....I dont want to donate to someone who is better than me, just to watch them play, because I can do that during practice rounds.

 

[Darth Anovin]

Just love these poorly thought out DGCR message board solutions in search of a real world problem.

Well, not really.

Just love when Scarpfish doesn't really have anything to add to a discussion, but feels the need to comment anyway just to remind us that he's not really adding anything to the discussion.

Well, not really.

 

[chris deitzel]

The biggest problem is that their are too many advanced players not playing open.

 

[chris deitzel]

Age protected divisions are good. Now that I am nearing 40, I understand that my body is not in the same shape that it was in 5-10 years ago. It's not unreasonable for these 40 year olds to not want to try and compete with the younger kids.

If everyone over 950 would step up and try playing pro, there would be no need for 2 pro fields. There would be a larger majority of 970-1000 rated players, fields would get bigger, payouts larger, and these 950+ players would realize that they can cash in the pro field.

 

[Tpro]

The biggest problem is that their are too many advanced players not playing open.

What makes the players open players and not advanced? To many people on the fence that cant place...

 

[chrishysell]

Age protected divisions are good. Now that I am nearing 40, I understand that my body is not in the same shape that it was in 5-10 years ago. It's not unreasonable for these 40 year olds to not want to try and compete with the younger kids.

If everyone over 950 would step up and try playing pro, there would be no need for 2 pro fields. There would be a larger majority of 970-1000 rated players, fields would get bigger, payouts larger, and these 950+ players would realize that they can cash in the pro field.

I wish there were less age protected divisions in both the amateur and pros. I played my best golf the year I turned 50. In some events playing either MPM or MPG I would have won the open or finished 2nd or third. That was last year when Schwebbie was on a tear and we played in many of the same events. This year I find myself relaxing and playing in mainly age protected divisions. My rating has fallen off and I refuse to blame it on age.

 

[JedV]

There would need to be a lot of added cash for the pro payouts to make this work.

 

[Chainsgoching]

Age protected divisions are good. Now that I am nearing 40, I understand that my body is not in the same shape that it was in 5-10 years ago. It's not unreasonable for these 40 year olds to not want to try and compete with the younger kids.

If everyone over 950 would step up and try playing pro, there would be no need for 2 pro fields. There would be a larger majority of 970-1000 rated players, fields would get bigger, payouts larger, and these 950+ players would realize that they can cash in the pro field.

I see your point Chris, but a 950 rated golfer is a 950 golfer, regardless of their age, They are able to throw up scores close to what the young guys that are 950 as well. If they werent , they would be rated differently. The PGA exhibits this very well. You think guys like Angel Cabrera likes playing against young guns like Rory McIroy or Ricky Fowler? Answer is, I think they do. I am 35 and still have some youth, so im a little biased, but the numbers dont lie.

 

[Thumber]

I am a long way from being a 1000 rated player. Not PDGA current but my handicap is roughly 4....so I think thats around 950?

I play Open for a couple of reasons. I like playing with the best players in the event. Not only do you play with the best, you get less rules violations, more respectful golf and less shenanigans. I like playing for cash. I don't want merch. I want money. Every once in a while I play well enough to cash. I sometimes even have a great day and win.

My game improved drastically once I got out of AM town and started playing open. To have Open restricted to only 1000 rated players would be a large mistake IMO. There isn't the critical mass needed to support a division like that. Plus you leave all the sub-1000 rated players forced to play for merch? F THAT. Ultimately you would end up alienating the very players you need for a sustainable Open field. I know I wouldn't likely play if I had to play AM

 

[Vonbeezy1]

I see your point Chris, but a 950 rated golfer is a 950 golfer, regardless of their age, They are able to throw up scores close to what the young guys that are 950 as well. If they werent , they would be rated differently. The PGA exhibits this very well. You think guys like Angel Cabrera likes playing against young guns like Rory McIroy or Ricky Fowler? Answer is, I think they do. I am 35 and still have some youth, so im a little biased, but the numbers dont lie.

Agreed. There are way too many age protected divisions.

 

[snappyfingers]

Here in LA, we have the opposite problem. Our Open division pool is fairly deep, including some 'Super Pros'. Because of that alot of Adv guys don't want to move up and just give their money to Rico, Rathwaite, Mcbeth or the several others who are here. This also creates clogging in the lower divisions. You need to shoot about 970 rated to win Int around here.

yep, I agree with this

 

[Agricolae]

I'm beginning to think that there should be but two divisions - Open and Participation.

Open division includes all who want to test their skills against the field, and ultimately, the best of the best.

In the Participation division, EVERYONE is a winner just for signing up and completing the rounds. Players pack is given out at the end as a prize. Special prizes, perhaps, for "Most Improved", "Best Attitude", "Best Outfit", "Most Unique Form" ...

(^^sarcasm ... but not entirely. )

 

[Rob Martin]

Actually... Out of the four Rob Martins in the country that are members of the PDGA...

whoa, Whoa, WHOA!

I'm gone for less than 24 hours and the thread drifts. Let's get back to the important thing folks.

MRM - Men Rob Martin. We'll accept any form of Rob Martin such as Robert Martin, Robert Martinez, Robert Martinek. But not Bob Martin. We are not Bob, we are Rob.

Let's keep it on track please.

 

[bradharris]

whoa, Whoa, WHOA!

I'm gone for less than 24 hours and the thread drifts. Let's get back to the important thing folks.

MRM - Men Rob Martin. We'll accept any form of Rob Martin such as Robert Martin, Robert Martinez, Robert Martinek. But not Bob Martin. We are not Bob, we are Rob.

Let's keep it on track please.

What about Martin Roberts?

 

[bluTDI09]

I wish people would stop feeling entitled to cash or win if there are players who are better than them. I think there should be two essential divisions and age protected versions of each: open (cash) and amateur (trophy). If you play as an am and someone beats you, they get the trophy. Don't whine about it... get better.

 

[AndyJB]

I hear a decent amount of people on here saying there should only be two divisions. Why not try a tournament that way? It can get expensive to run tourneys (hence why I don't TD very much) but you might be able to get your club on board. Especially if you sell it to them as being something unique, something they can put their stamp on.

There ARE events that do this. They are few, but they almost always fill up because they are well run, quality events. Those of you who are of the aforementioned opinion should try it out on a B or C Tier scale. See if you can still get a bunch of people to sign up.

Push your idea forward. See if it works.