2018 USDGC

[lenfantsuave]

As for the commentary...

Avery is a very smart and insightful commentator.
If you can get past the excessive verbiage and the self-importance.

Someone please tell Avery:
1. That he isn't getting paid by the word.
2. They aren't going to deduct his pay if he lets a few silent seconds pass so we can watch the action.
3. His commentary would be better if he remembered that he should only speak when he has something new to contribute (see #1 above)
4. He is there to inform us and enlighten us, not prove that he is the smartest man alive.
5. Self-diminishment goes a long way toward drawing the listener into the unfolding drama.
6. The action is the "thing", not the commentator(s).
7. Listen to Jamie...

I would contend that Avery's problem is more that he doesn't know what to say when his go to lines or the "script" doesn't work. The reason everyone loves Nate and Jerm so much is because they are witty and fluid. Avery is like that guy I know at work who speaks as fast as possible to make sure he says all of his lines when making a sale. It kind of works I guess, but he's way less genuine and dynamic than someone who just knows how to have a conversation with people who happen to be buying stuff from him.

 

[Reniger]

he's way less genuine

All that needs to be said... Awkward and disingenuous.

 

[lyleoross]

I listen to a podcast called the total soccer show. Yesterday, they interviewed Tim Howard about his new gig as a commentator for TNT. He said this in a really simple way. New commentators want everything buttoned up. No mistakes, I know exactly what I'm gonna say. Good commentators are having a chat with their bud on the couch while watching. They make mistakes and laugh it off or simply fix it.

 

[DiscFifty]

https://www.innovadiscs.com/uncategorized/more-media-for-the-20th-anniversary-of-usdgc/

"We've brought in live streaming pros, Fulcrum Media Group, to help produce the "Hole 17 Live" streaming video show for the final two rounds. "Hole 17 Live" is hosted by World Champion Avery Jenkins and disc golf media veteran Jamie Thomas as the two highlight action around USDGC's most dramatic hole. In addition to Hole 17 drama, they can break away to cameras throughout the course to bring you action as it unfolds. There's more. They've got a lineup of special guests who'll share insights and analysis of disc golf's greatest competition."

hmm....getting that "banter fest" vibe again. Hoping it's not.....

 

[gogo]

Maybe smashboxx can find a way to do live audio commentary of the broadcast so when you've had enough of Avery and Jamie you don't have to put the coverage on mute and play music.

Kinda like watching the watch party live from JVD's basement. Oh I forgot it's not a basement but smashboxx studio.

 

[lyleoross]

Maybe smashboxx can find a way to do live audio commentary of the broadcast so when you've had enough of Avery and Jamie you don't have to put the coverage on mute and play music.

Kinda like watching the watch party live from JVD's basement. Oh I forgot it's not a basement but smashboxx studio.

During the world Cup I would turn on one channel and the sound from another, mixing to get what I wanted.

Smash can't afford to dutch a relationship by doing something like that, though.

 

[Harold Duvall]

What do you think the audience wants to hear about the course from the designers' perspectives.

~ Harold

 

[Mspot]

I want to hear the reasoning for making the changes. Why do you think the old designs needed a change? and how you expect it to change play/scoring. Can't wait to see it.

 

[Steve West]

What do you think the audience wants to hear about the course from the designers' perspectives.

~ Harold

I want to hear a lot of sharp criticism about how the players are stupidly playing it wrong.

 

[lyleoross]

I want to hear what you're trying to accomplish overall, and then how each hole contributes to that. I have also enjoyed commentary on how designers mix and match hole types to keep players from getting into a rythm. Either that, or what Steve said.

 

[Flick Maniac]

Id like to hear about any and all misplays that may or may not occur due to rather complex designs. For example like on holes where you can throw and remain OB and miss a mando in the process, will all of the players who do this remember that if the OB happens first, you dont go to a mando DZ but play the OB as it stands. (Unless of course there is a OB DZ too)

 

[Harold Duvall]

The Gold Course rules are complicated. I wish I could add lakes and tress instead or ropes and mandatories.

We tried to simplify the situation you describe by creating a ground rule that specifies that the mandatory rule takes precedence on throws that miss a mandatory and subsequently establish a position OB. Hopefully this attempt to simplify does not complicate.

~ Harold

 

[DiscJunkie]

What do you think the audience wants to hear about the course from the designers' perspectives.

~ Harold

I am interested in design decisions and how they are intended to affect decision-making.
Why is the OB rope here instead of there?
How/Why does the OB rope come into play from the tee, or on the approach or on at the basket?
Why did we change that from last year or previous years?
How does the OB/Hazard/Bunker/water come into play on a particular throw and how does it affect the decision of the player?
Also, it is difficult to visualize a hole and the OB placement relative to topography when watching online. Let us know when, like on Hole 3, the slope doesn't translate well to video.
This kind of info is what we like to hear from commentators and guests and special features like "Featured Hole" clips.

 

[krupicka]

The Gold Course rules are complicated. I wish I could add lakes and tress instead or ropes and mandatories.

We tried to simplify the situation you describe by creating a ground rule that specifies that the mandatory rule takes precedence on throws that miss a mandatory and subsequently establish a position OB. Hopefully this attempt to simplify does not complicate.

~ Harold

I always find the USDGC course rules very well written and use them as a model when trying to figure out how to word some course rules at my events. Thank you for your attention to detail.

 

[Flick Maniac]

The Gold Course rules are complicated. I wish I could add lakes and tress instead or ropes and mandatories.

We tried to simplify the situation you describe by creating a ground rule that specifies that the mandatory rule takes precedence on throws that miss a mandatory and subsequently establish a position OB. Hopefully this attempt to simplify does not complicate.

~ Harold

Yeah I kind of thought thats what you were trying to do, but it still is not evident unfortunately. Like here:

Caddybook Q&A

Question: What if a throw misses a mandatory
and comes to rest in OB or Hazard?
Answer: Once the disc has missed the mandatory
(a throw is considered to have missed the
mandatory if it passes the incorrect side of the
mandatory line from the direction of the tee,
and comes to rest lying completely beyond that
line) OB or Hazard rules do not create further
issues. Note: Mandatory lines extend into the
OB and Hazard.

"Create further issues" is super vague. When something is vague, as a player, I would default to the standard rules, whether it was myself or another on my player facing the situation, and whether it benefits myself (or them) or not.

You have also addressed hole 8 separately:

Hole 8 – Question: Can a player use the Hole
8 drop zone for OB throws from the tee or
fairway?
Answer: No, the drop zone on this hole can be
used only for throws that miss the mandatory
or go OB from the drop zone.

Unfortunately that does not make it clear either. It actually seems to suggest the opposite, i.e. if you look at the rulebook, OB shot that stays OB, whether missing a mando while flying OB or not, the play should be according to OB rules, and not the mando DZ.

I dont think too many situations like this will happen, but if they do, I think most players will go to the DZ, which is what you were aiming at yes, but while doing that they are not strictly playing by the rules. They may also likely get a better angle from the DZ than from where they crossed OB.

 

[krupicka]

i.e. if you look at the rulebook, OB shot that stays OB, whether missing a mando while flying OB or not, the play should be according to OB rules, and not the mando DZ.

You need to reread the rule book on this one.

QA-APP-2
When multiple violations have occurred
on a single throw, how do I determine
which rule was first violated, given that a
rule has not been violated until the disc
has come to rest?
The meaning of "first" in the rule is the
common understanding of when the disc
first enters a state where it is in violation of
a rule. One common pair of rules that can
be violated during a single throw are OB
and Mandatory. In that case, you would
compare when the disc last crossed into
OB with when it crossed the mandatory
line, and play whichever happened first

Under PDGA rules, missing a mandatory requires you to determine if a disc while crossing the mandatory line was over OB space. What the USDGC is doing is simplifying the matter so one does not need to make that determination and just consider everything missing the mandatory as missing the mandatory regardless of other events that may have occurred. It is actually much simpler (and IMO should be how the standard PDGA rules should be).

 

[_MTL_]

The Gold Course rules are complicated. I wish I could add lakes and tress instead or ropes and mandatories.

Agreed. Which is why I'm surprised hole 5 had a mando added last year on the tree which is on the lake.

 

[bwgort]

What players are at Monday qualifying today?

 

[billyjacko]

Late to the party, but I'm excited to see what Fulcrum accomplishes with this style of coverage. I'm particularly curious about how tying in live footage from the Jomez cams will look like. You hear Terry talk about how you have to film things differently when it's broadcasted live, and anyone who's been to a tournament while Jomez is out there, they run around like crazy setting up shots. I'm wondering if the live aspect of their footage will effect the post production quality at all. I think more footage of more players, and more holes is going to be beneficial. I don't really need to see routine 150' up shots, and cleanup puts. I'd rather watch that dude take a 10 on 17, lol. I'll agree with others that I'm not particularly excited for the Avery and Jamie Thomas combo. I think both of those guys force themselves into "commentator" voices, and it ends up sounding a bit cringy.

On a side note, it feels like this could be Ricky's tournament. He's been so close so many times, and he was dialed at the Delaware NT.

 

[Zanguini]

I have to give the edge to Sexton, his style excels at courses with plenty of artificial OB. But i imagine it will come down to McBeth and Sexton. I think Ricky's putting has been a little off all season.