2014 United States Disc Golf Championship

[BgWvDave]

It was 8 minutes from the time the spotter flagged that Paul was IB before he threw the second shot. Your comments state that the spotter new the chair was an issue when the shot landed. Too bad he didn't make Paul, Bill or yourself aware.

True that!

 

[Mr. Anderson]

The chair cannot be considered an obstacle ie. inherently a part of the course, unless it was stated beforehand that it is a design element. Being the chair can be moved at anytime by the owner it is not an obstacle.

 

[elnino]

That was rough to watch.

I think Will has the best "roc shot" in the game! he can throw it on lines and land it flat well over 400 feet.

Did JohnE have family on his bag. May have been great for support but maybe someone that had a worst case scenario in mind would have made him layup or coached him between fast second throws.

 

[heartman]

Did JohnE have family on his bag. May have been great for support but maybe someone that had a worst case scenario in mind would have made him layup or coached him between fast second throws.

his wife

 

[mashnut]

The chair cannot be considered an obstacle ie. inherently a part of the course, unless it was stated beforehand that it is a design element. Being the chair can be moved at anytime by the owner it is not an obstacle.

While I agree that the rules allow for movement of the chair, I disagree with your justification. By that logic, any logs, mounds, hay bales, walls, fences, tee signs etc. can be moved from where the designer put them if the TD didn't specifically state otherwise.

 

[TalbotTrojan]

That was rough to watch.

I think Will has the best "roc shot" in the game! he can throw it on lines and land it flat well over 400 feet.

Did JohnE have family on his bag. May have been great for support but maybe someone that had a worst case scenario in mind would have made him layup or coached him between fast second throws.

Usually JohnE has his wife Jennifer on his bag. In the little bit that I watched of the USDGC this year, it was his wife carrying his bag.

 

[Plankeye]

I pulled up a 2007 Rule Book and found this:
803.05 Obstacles and Relief
B. Obstacles Between the Lie and Hole:
..... A player may move obstacles between the lie and
the hole that became a factor during
the round, such as spectators, players'
equipment, open gates, or branches that
fell during the round. Where it is not
known if an obstacle has become a factor
during a round, it shall not be moved. It
is legal for a player's throwing motion to
make incidental movement of an obstacle.


This is no longer in the rules or Q&A as far as I can tell.

I've been looking for that rule ever since chairgate happened because I knew it use to be a rule. I never noticed that it was taken out of the rule book. Any reason why it was?

 

[Dave242]

As JC noted up-thread, there is really no way (in most/many cases) for a player to know when an obstacle appears (branches, gates, vehicles...not spectators or players' equipment usually). So, how do you enforce that or determine that to begin with? An indeterminate and/or unenforceable rule is a bad rule and should not be in the rule book.

 

[Mr. Anderson]

While I agree that the rules allow for movement of the chair, I disagree with your justification. By that logic, any logs, mounds, hay bales, walls, fences, tee signs etc. can be moved from where the designer put them if the TD didn't specifically state otherwise.

Would you say the logs, hay bales, walls fences, tee signs are personal or public property?

 

[tom12003]

Someone very wise once told me, "Never stand when you can sit, and never sit when you can lie down."

I have spotted at the USDGC. I was there this year spotting the tee shot on hole 5 on Thursday. I put my Camp Time Roll-A-Stool underneath a tree in an OB area that would be damned near impossible for a player's shot to be near. About every fifth or sixth card, I would go over and take a seat in the shade, and maybe get a drink of water while waiting for the next card to throw.

Have you ever spent a week volunteering at something like the USDGC? If not, please refrain from calling me or any of the other volunteers that make this event possible lazy.

^^^^
I've spotted for the past 4 years (hole 9) and a stool is important equipment if one is to survive 6+ straight hours each day. There have been several times where there was 10+ minutes between groups and taking a seat is not being lazy. My stool was never in-bounds or anywhere near being involved (although I did ask BigWVDave on Saturday where I should put my stool in the fairway).

As an aside, most (but not all) spotters at the USDGC are also certified officials. We were not designated to act as officials by the TD; that responsibility was largely assigned to the marshals by the TD and the PDGA.

 

[elnino]

Usually JohnE has his wife Jennifer on his bag. In the little bit that I watched of the USDGC this year, it was his wife carrying his bag.

Probably helped him overall having strong support on his bag just believe that a coach type caddie other than family might have stepped in and said," layup here and you win" while family and loved ones are just going to believe in you which is amazing to have and he might not been there if not for his wife supporting but somebody needed to make that call/have the totals in mind.

Also must have thrown ob twice in under 15 seconds. One needs to take a timeout/ reset on those hard to stomach shots.

 

[Van1]

Probably helped him overall having strong support on his bag just believe that a coach type caddie other than family might have stepped in and said," layup here and you win" while family and loved ones are just going to believe in you which is amazing to have and he might not been there if not for his wife supporting but somebody needed to make that call/have the totals in mind.

Also must have thrown ob twice in under 15 seconds. One needs to take a timeout/ reset on those hard to stomach shots.

Is there an easy layup on 17? There is another hole where John E layed up the last two rounds and he gained strokes in the group so I know he plays smart. Playing 17 a little to the right of the basket seems like the safe shot. Is there a safer one?

 

[JC17393]

Is there an easy layup on 17? There is another hole where John E layed up the last two rounds and he gained strokes in the group so I know he plays smart. Playing 17 a little to the right of the basket seems like the safe shot. Is there a safer one?

This has been discussed multiple times in the thread already.

There's sixty feet of fairway directly in front of the tee that is in bounds. Pitching up to a spot there allows a much wider array of shot angles and a shorter throw in general.

Part of the difficulty of hole 17 is the tunnel from which you have to tee off. It forces you to throw a relatively flat shot to get out. Flat flight makes it much tougher to stop the disc on a dime on that postage stamp green. Add in that by throwing backhand, John (and Paul and Will and Pat for that matter) were turning over their shot to aim it at the fat part of the green on the right and their shots are susceptible to gliding longer than intended. Which is exactly what happened to John's first shot, leading to him overcompensating and coming up short on his second and third attempts.

Laying up takes the tunnel out of play. It's a 160-170 foot shot to the green from there (slightly longer if you're playing for the wide side on the right). Still a relatively simple shot for players of this caliber. Players of lesser skill than they are able to execute it for a 3, I've seen it done. There's no case for "you can't lay up" on that hole. You can choose not to, but the option is definitely available.

 

[gcr_russell]

Is there an easy layup on 17? There is another hole where John E layed up the last two rounds and he gained strokes in the group so I know he plays smart. Playing 17 a little to the right of the basket seems like the safe shot. Is there a safer one?

There is, although I never saw anyone take it in the footage. In front of and to the left of the tee for about 80-100 feet is in bounds. It makes the next shot up to the basket much safer and easier, but gives you no realistic shot at the birdie and still a possibly scary 3.

 

[Cinque]

Is there any footage of Paige making it across the water on her first try? I think DGPlanet missed it.

 

[WhiteyBear]

Remember that one time where Will Schusterick won the 2014 USDGC by having less mistakes, unforced errors, and lower scores than everyone else?

The championship was not lost by a chair, or lost by not laying up, it was WON by a guy not giving up.

Kudos to Will for WINNING the USDGC, not for Paul or Johne LOSING the USDGC. It's pretty sad that people would rather detract from Will's 3rd title than congratulate him for it.

 

[JTacoma03]

Is there any footage of Paige making it across the water on her first try? I think DGPlanet missed it.

I missed it too. I was pissed. :\

 

[paulw]

Remember that one time where Will Schusterick won the 2014 USDGC by having less mistakes, unforced errors, and lower scores than everyone else?

The championship was not lost by a chair, or lost by not laying up, it was WON by a guy not giving up.

Kudos to Will for WINNING the USDGC, not for Paul or Johne LOSING the USDGC. It's pretty sad that people would rather detract from Will's 3rd title than congratulate him for it.

Lighten up Francis. After the dust clears the only relevant item is who has the trophy.

As a video junkie, isn't the Disc Golf Guy's coverage a better way to watch the video of the tourney? The spintv thing just seems too laise faire -- ? Terry may owe me $100, but the way his video, while disjointed due to lack of any actual funds, makes sense since you get to appreciate the pressure of the moment . .. ? n'est ce pas?

Just saying.

 

[Rolex81]

Is there any footage of Paige making it across the water on her first try? I think DGPlanet missed it.

Hopefully there is. She crushed it. All the men were trying to throw big sky annys. She hyzerflipped her disc on a fairly flat line and it just took off. Was very impressive

 

[heartman]

All the men were trying to throw big sky annys.

from Simon Lizotte's blog:

The distance showcase on Saturday was not a success unfortunately. I tested the discs we were going to throw on Thursday and the Echo Star Destroyer seemed to be the right decision. Somehow those red ones we were throwing on Saturday were A LOT different from the ones I tested. Extremely flippy. Most shots ended up in the water because all of us threw sky rollers. The highlights were, no doubt, that Paige made it over the lake and that Big Jerm hit a basket for the first time ever. AMAZING!