Informed, constructive criticism is fair; carping isn't.
In tone, if not substance, some—perhaps many—of the posts clearly crossed the line from constructive criticism to carping.
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2015 European Open coverage thread/split from Tournament thread
- Thread starter heartman
- Start date
Informed, constructive criticism is fair; carping isn't.
In tone, if not substance, some—perhaps many—of the posts clearly crossed the line from constructive criticism to carping.
How can we make the internets fair for you? What's the proper "tone" to type in? I wish my critism could be constructive and informed to please you. Or maybe you're carping?
bogeyfreetilinfinity
Eagle Member
Awesome final round video!
Please be more precise here. The live broadcast wasn't targeted to only disc golfers at all.
Lol well I can promise no one else cares.
ncgamedog
Birdie Member
I read through some of this, and I really don't understand why there is so much discussion about such a simple and common subject.
The insider show was good and well done. That being said, it was a loaded baked potato with NO Steak (or as someone said, "an all-bread sandwich")
Its like not filming the Super Bowl, and only being able to watch NFL network analyists talk about it...
No one really cares about a wrap up show when you can't view the subject of the conversation - the event.
It boarderlined as teasing the audience, and probably why folks are a bit hostile or aggrivated. Teasing works well as a marketing ploy, but only when you have a product to deliver.
I would have paid to watch. I kept scrambling looking for coverage and only found the insider show. I kept waiting for it to turn into an infomercial where they were going to show a link and say; "If you've enjoyed the insider show and want to be a part of the live coverage, follow the link below and Paypal $19.99 to SpinTV.com for full event access"
I'd have been mad that I had to pay, but I still would have cause I really wanted to watch this tourney.
I DO apprecieate the vision and hard work JT is putting into the sport, and he strikes me as an intelligent guy, so I'm not hating on what was done.
Something just doesnt seem right about this. It honeslty feels political or something. Its clearly common sense that the event should have had full live coverage, and I have yet to hear a clear reason why there wasnt.
Was it lack of funding?
Lack or resourses?
Lack of permission?
How can the disc golf community support this NOT happening again in the future?
Do we need a fundraiser?
Show interest by poll or petition?
How can we help?
The insider show was good and well done. That being said, it was a loaded baked potato with NO Steak (or as someone said, "an all-bread sandwich")
Its like not filming the Super Bowl, and only being able to watch NFL network analyists talk about it...
No one really cares about a wrap up show when you can't view the subject of the conversation - the event.
It boarderlined as teasing the audience, and probably why folks are a bit hostile or aggrivated. Teasing works well as a marketing ploy, but only when you have a product to deliver.
I would have paid to watch. I kept scrambling looking for coverage and only found the insider show. I kept waiting for it to turn into an infomercial where they were going to show a link and say; "If you've enjoyed the insider show and want to be a part of the live coverage, follow the link below and Paypal $19.99 to SpinTV.com for full event access"
I'd have been mad that I had to pay, but I still would have cause I really wanted to watch this tourney.
I DO apprecieate the vision and hard work JT is putting into the sport, and he strikes me as an intelligent guy, so I'm not hating on what was done.
Something just doesnt seem right about this. It honeslty feels political or something. Its clearly common sense that the event should have had full live coverage, and I have yet to hear a clear reason why there wasnt.
Was it lack of funding?
Lack or resourses?
Lack of permission?
How can the disc golf community support this NOT happening again in the future?
Do we need a fundraiser?
Show interest by poll or petition?
How can we help?
I dunno, dude. Much is made of the crowds at the tourney and the popularity of disc golf in Finland...the live broadcast was on Finnish TV (and the internets - but only if you went and found it)...so who was that targeting then?
The wrap-up show, featuring 1970s-style PBS talking heads sitting around a set, targeted ONLY disc golfers, and more specifically, those who had been at that day's event and seen the golf, because, as noted, the show was incredibly light on highlights and golf shots.
Earlier in this thread, I posited the theory that Jussi was targeting future Sponsors and Media Cos. with the media they produced, and I still think that may be the case...
One thing we do know is that the Course and the event are tailor-made to provide the PROS with the best event possible, and that shouldn't be overlooked.
The crowd of 4500 at the European Open finals looked like a pretty mixed bag. Sure, a small army of disc golfers was there, but I think the kids were key. They seem into it, forming all these autograph lines, and naturally draw in their families to check out the action. I noticed plenty of older and younger casual folk in the gallery.
Jussi admitted on the Finnish forums that live TV was vital for sponsors to support the event, so you're at least partially right. I'm waiting for their announcement on TV ratings in which they, the broadcaster and the sponsors were apparently very satisfied in. Jussi already let us know that the amount of viewers didn't stagnate, but steadily increased towards the final hole. Their primary target was mainstream audience.
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Not sure about common sense...seems we are a little spoiled by live coverage. Jussi et al were able to negotiate to get final round coverage live on national TV. Perhaps, they even sold the rights to that coverage, and made some money!
It would be a little difficult to allow others to provide coverage of the rest of the tourney without whoever was providing the coverage to pay for it as well, including their own company, SpinTV.
Several have mentioned being willing to pay for coverage, which is great. But realistically, how many paid subscriptions would there be...in the US? Worldwide? At what price?
FTR, I don't watch live coverage cuz I can't invest 4-5 hours of watching people walk to the next tee or wait on the tee. It's painful to me. I much prefer next day or next week or next month coverage. So my question is, was there a way to negotiate that into the into the media rights, to allow for future free footage, after the fact??
In Finland. Population approx. 5.5 million
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The fact that you have to "ask" is sufficient proof which categor you really belong in.
Yep. The audience here is big enough to go for and that's what Spin18 are satisfied for the time being. Doing any more live coverage with their setup isn't fruitful enough yet.
The internet, new technology, and globalization in general debunk that argument. Maybe 20 years ago that would've been true. Why limit yourself? Most businesses target the global market unless they are ok with forfeiting potential profits or are just ignorant.
BgWvDave
Double Eagle Member
Media Report
http://www.opendiscgolf.com/2015/07/24/eo2015-makes-waves-in-media/
opcorn:opcorn:opcorn:
http://www.opendiscgolf.com/2015/07/24/eo2015-makes-waves-in-media/
opcorn:opcorn:opcorn:
OK, I'll hear that arguement that the live, 3-hole broadcast was targeted at a larger audience than just disc golfers since it was broadcast on public Finnish tele, and covering only the finnish(
) would certainly get those curious about the sport to watch. Hard to argue that about the Insider Show however. Very well said.
I certainly think a fundraising campaign for filming purposes would be a great idea. I don't know the numbers that were donated to Terry & Co during the Memorial, but I imagine they were a decent help. Anyone have a dollar figure? Same goes to the CCDG guys, as before the Innova sponsorship they had a donation site, though it wasn't pushed very heavily.
I certainly would never underestimate the generosity of our sport's enthusiasts. We are a grassroots sport with a grassroots mindset. I am astounded every year at the level of commitment passed along through the disc golf family for the Okthrowberfest disc dyeing competition. All they get out of it is seeing an even smaller niche in our disc golf world create art on plastic, and yet, every year, the donations are truly impressive. From the big name manufacturers to so many people on this site --- if we can generate a few thousand dollars worth of prizes for a dye competition, I'm certain we could do the same to generate a revenue stream for high quality video coverage.
ncgamedog
Birdie Member
To the Coverage Fundraiser point:
I comonly see a healthy handfull of quality guys/groups covering our various events on YouTube.
Jomez, CCDG, thediscgolfguy, lcgm8, SpinTV, Smashboxx, McFly So High, ect.
Maybe there should be some periodic Fundraiser events, and/or partial entry fees, that could go toward an Escrow acct that would be set up to aid in media coverage. There could be an agreement that Majors and NTs will be covered using a set of established standards. These will be divided up among the entities (like listed above) based on their ability and capacity to cover the event based on the standards.
So if I wanted to cover an event I would submit a formal "bid" or "proposal" to the controlling body (PDGA?)
If I was deemed to have reasonable capcity (i.e. enough staff and cameras of a particular quality), then I would be awarded the right to cover the event. Along with that would be access to a predetermined amount of support funds from the Escrow, which would be delivered at the end of the event (or 60/40 to aid in setup and travel).
There could also be a provision where you could donate a little extra when you renew or purchase a new PDGA membership. Donations would be awarded with a login/password that would give exclusive access to the Insider Show and other bonus coverage.
By giving eveyone a chance, it would allow multiple people cover different events.
Establishing the "Standards" would be the key. This way the coverage would be consistent, but allow enough room to allow the different groups to incorporate their own style.
Also having an average dollar amount would help to know if this is even plausable.
What would it cost to cover an event like a major PGA event? Multiple crews cameras that could cover at least the top 3 cards with a tee shot view and a landing view. I hate loosing the disc or missing the scope of the shot. I assume drones would be VITAL.
Maybe coverage could at least follow the lead card and cut back to a couple signature holes to show different folks on an exciting shot.
Like DirecTV's Masters Coverage where they keep cutting back to "Amen Corner"
^^ Maybe I'm dreaming here
What would it cost to offer two views and a drone just following the lead card?
I comonly see a healthy handfull of quality guys/groups covering our various events on YouTube.
Jomez, CCDG, thediscgolfguy, lcgm8, SpinTV, Smashboxx, McFly So High, ect.
Maybe there should be some periodic Fundraiser events, and/or partial entry fees, that could go toward an Escrow acct that would be set up to aid in media coverage. There could be an agreement that Majors and NTs will be covered using a set of established standards. These will be divided up among the entities (like listed above) based on their ability and capacity to cover the event based on the standards.
So if I wanted to cover an event I would submit a formal "bid" or "proposal" to the controlling body (PDGA?)
If I was deemed to have reasonable capcity (i.e. enough staff and cameras of a particular quality), then I would be awarded the right to cover the event. Along with that would be access to a predetermined amount of support funds from the Escrow, which would be delivered at the end of the event (or 60/40 to aid in setup and travel).
There could also be a provision where you could donate a little extra when you renew or purchase a new PDGA membership. Donations would be awarded with a login/password that would give exclusive access to the Insider Show and other bonus coverage.
By giving eveyone a chance, it would allow multiple people cover different events.
Establishing the "Standards" would be the key. This way the coverage would be consistent, but allow enough room to allow the different groups to incorporate their own style.
Also having an average dollar amount would help to know if this is even plausable.
What would it cost to cover an event like a major PGA event? Multiple crews cameras that could cover at least the top 3 cards with a tee shot view and a landing view. I hate loosing the disc or missing the scope of the shot. I assume drones would be VITAL.
Maybe coverage could at least follow the lead card and cut back to a couple signature holes to show different folks on an exciting shot.
Like DirecTV's Masters Coverage where they keep cutting back to "Amen Corner"
^^ Maybe I'm dreaming here
What would it cost to offer two views and a drone just following the lead card?
Not until there's actual global demand for disc golf broadcasting.
By the way, online streaming is generally not on the required level yet to make commercial streaming a viable option. There was an independent TV station that tried it with ice hockey, but failed miserably and is now on the verge of bankruptcy. But who knows, maybe in the near future disc golf could capitalize when the technology advances.
EDIT: The TV ratings are impressive, by the way. That's quite a few people in Finland alone who know what Paul McBeth does.
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