Blueberry just tied Flip City!

[PA Frolfer]

1. PAFrolfer (eeeek) obviously has a negative agenda towards Flip. He gives this away by mentioning at least a few times the same tin hat conspiracy about Flips possible "fake" reviews. Timg settled this birther myth a while back. Just cause a local yokle puts up a three sentence review does not make it fake.

What negative agenda do I have towards Flip City? My supposed positive bias towards Highbridge? I am from PA. I was just stating that Flip City has a lot of one liner reviews that certainly seem to be fake.

2. A 3 star rating towards Flip is an idiotic rating. Period. But what can one expect out of 80 plus reviews. We all have the right to our own opinion, but there are sometimes when you can clearly state something is dumb and be right...and this is that time.

LOL - I thought I was entitled to my own opinion? I guess not?

3. Having "umptine" friends (including tourney level pros) that have played both amazing courses (make that three if we re-include Idlewild) NONE of these courses should EVER rate below a four. EVER.

I'd love to teach you statistics (ie, having umptine friends certainly makes something statistically significant) but I feel that would be a waste of time....

4. Flip not a tourney course is complete rubbish and shows ignorance towards our great game. Last year the hot tourney round was a -10 for 24 holes. That was by Liz Carr who beat out Geoff Bennett (male pro) for that distinction. -10 for 24 holes, think about it. That's a pro tourney score/challenge. Long distances do not equate to tourney caliber in every case.

I don't get it - negative ten for 24 holes is good or bad? If someone can shot a 62 for 24 holes, that's a challenge? I just witnessed an easy tournament in Illinois where the winner of the pro division shot 105 for 40 holes (-15 under) on what is known to be a very easy course. The winner of the advanced division shot the same score. Negative 10 for 24 holes screams easy to me....

6. This thread...dumb on many levels. Including me wasting all this time putting a few thoughts in a numbers format.

Then please refrain from discussing this anymore :|

PA Frolfer r u a PA resident...if so what courses have u played there?

Actually I just moved here for work - haven't got a chance to play too much, but I have played Knob Hill and Ashtabula. Wasn't impressed with either, especially with the high ratings Knob Hill gets. What else would you suggest playing near the Erie area? (I know, there's not much in Erie...it sucks)

I don't care what I sound like, its the truth. To me the pictures of Highbridge hurt the courses, for how good the reviews are. It's not going to stop me from playing Highbridge in the next couple years though. Then I will rate it with a non-bias opinion, based on the same scale I use for every course i've played.

Wait, what? The pictures hurt the Highbridge courses? Is this a joke??!! Since when should the pictures of ANY course determine ratings? That's like saying the pictures of Pebble Beach golf course don't do justice to the course. Of course they don't. Pictures are what they are - pictures. Judging anything based on pictures is crazy. I for one am glad we have people like you to review courses on DG Course Review based on pictures. Thanks!

 

[Terry C]

I give average courses a 3 disc rating. It is an insult to give such an amazing course like Flip 3 discs. Ive played 30+ courses and nothing even comes close to the quality of Flip City. I can see maybe giving it 4 1/2 discs for a rating but 3 is a joke. Flip is damn near perfect in every way. What you have to realize is when something gets reviewed 100 times then there are going to be a few people who take a dump on it, no matter how good it is. My friend has about 10,000 positive feedbacks on ebay and like 5 negative. All the negatives were douchebags who were complaining about him taking 2 hours to return their emails and stupid stuff like that. Those people are out there.

 

[NateDiscFlip]

The course is PRIVATE...and the owner ain't a D!ck....hope that is short enough for a good review...not to mention people play all the other courses surrounding the course...it's not just flip....it's the FLIP CITY EXPERIENCE that is getting all the rave reviews....don't hate the course, hate those who can't see the light!

as for blueberry....maybe it's too far away to get it's props...I see those who review it are loving it...but it is 18 to 86...however the rating is more communistic than consensus...

If I ever play it, I am sure to give it it's dues....and I aced #14 for the other haters!...you know who you are!!!LOL...suckas!!!

 

[DirtyMittenDG]

Wait, what? The pictures hurt the Highbridge courses? Is this a joke??!! Since when should the pictures of ANY course determine ratings? That's like saying the pictures of Pebble Beach golf course don't do justice to the course. Of course they don't. Pictures are what they are - pictures. Judging anything based on pictures is crazy. I for one am glad we have people like you to review courses on DG Course Review based on pictures. Thanks!

Why would you think I rate courses based on pictures? I didn't mean the pictures hurt the rating, just that they don't make the courses look like what they're cracked up to be, in my opinion at least. No offense to the people who took the pictures either, the course just doesn't really look like it's in very good condition in those pics.

 

[tallpaul]

Not tryin' to pick on you star164; but, those who complain about a little tall grass at a 6+ course complex, have never spent a summer as a landscaper. Just sayin'....

 

[DirtyMittenDG]

Not tryin' to pick on you star164; but, those who complain about a little tall grass at a 6+ course complex, have never spent a summer as a landscaper. Just sayin'....

Now that I look back at the pictures, it does look like theres pretty good maintenance done there. I guess it's just the courses themselves that don't look to much better than average.

 

[tallpaul]

They're all "average" to the level they're geared towards; which is the lure of the complex....courses for all levels of players. If you want above average; play the level above your level as a player; take the beat down; and then play something less strenuous. Will still have 4+ options available to play. Elevation; views; terraced rock greens and tee areas; wide open, wooded technical... Water, really the only thing missing; and there's a little of it; with more to come on Whitetail, I hear.... I really don't want to come off as a huge High Bridge defender; cheerleader; just responding to posts.

 

[NDABRUSH]

They're all "average" to the level they're geared towards; which is the lure of the complex....courses for all levels of players. If you want above average; play the level above your level as a player; take the beat down; and then play something less strenuous. Will still have 4+ options available to play. Elevation; views; terraced rock greens and tee areas; wide open, wooded technical... Water, really the only thing missing; and there's a little of it; with more to come on Whitetail, I hear.... I really don't want to come off as a huge High Bridge defender; cheerleader; just responding to posts.

If the owner of the Highbridge courses original plan was to make the ultimate DG getway in 1 place, looks like he's done it. From the descriptions it looks like something for all tastes. That's just from reading reviews and the course descriptions. Like you said Tallpaul, the courses there might get an extra 1/2 disc or so just from being a part of the Highbridge experience.

 

[superberry]

I support you entirely PA Frolfer, but under the understanding that I have not yet played Flip. Everyone raves about the experience, but that lends to a biased review, not necessarily a good course. To get a 5 in my mind, a course needs amazing balance and variety in conjunction with some amazing terrain. I get the sense that Flip is lacking water hazards, OB, long downhill bombers, tight wooded tunnels, holes over 500', holes under 200' and amazingly tight, wide open 600' rippers, risky greens, elevated tees/greens, sharp elevbation changes, and balance of left/right/straight and uphill/downhill/acrosshill shots. More than 18 holes is always a plus, but without all these elements of variety and balance, I wouldn't give a 5 either.

 

[superberry]

If the owner of the Highbridge courses original plan was to make the ultimate DG getway in 1 place, looks like he's done it. From the descriptions it looks like something for all tastes. That's just from reading reviews and the course descriptions. Like you said Tallpaul, the courses there might get an extra 1/2 disc or so just from being a part of the Highbridge experience.

The courses defintely get a extra 1/2 disc for being part of the complex as a whole. I admit in in my reviews, and have also updated them to state that I am nearly appauled by the crappy tee signs of a disc golf "megaplex", and should decrease all my ratings accordingly. But when you play contrasting, contradicting, and complimenting courses altogether at the HB complex, you get a bit of bias going on. To be fair and honest though, highbridge does have it all - water, OB, elevation, tight woods, open rippers, risky greens, more than 18 holes, balance, and more!

 

[superberry]

tallpaul, you can't unfairly keep HB Gold down! It's back in at #10 - go and adjust to the 5-disc rating you know it deserves, let the additional reviews sort it out!

 

[tallpaul]

I'm not sure how that happened; no reviews for either Woodshed or HB Gold?

 

[Scoot_er]

should be heading up there soon.

4. Flip not a tourney course is complete rubbish and shows ignorance towards our great game. Last year the hot tourney round was a -10 for 24 holes. That was by Liz Carr who beat out Geoff Bennett (male pro) for that distinction. -10 for 24 holes, think about it. That's a pro tourney score/challenge. Long distances do not equate to tourney caliber in every case.

I never said it wasn't a tournament course I was trying to say it would rate as high based solely on a tournament setting/layout vs MANY of the others on here which rate lower due to casual players rating them lower than a Adv or Pro player would

Also you blew your argument out of the water with this post! -10 for 24 holes is a fairly easy course.........especially when Liz is the person shooting the round. Not knocking her but the round was probably 1020 at the most (one of the best rounds by a woman) meaning a 1000 rated round is -7. To me it seems that flip lacks true par 4s which are needed in my opinion to rate a course a 4 and they need a few to be a 5.

Sounds like a great course to go play casually my whole point is that there are better tournament courses around......

 

[Scoot_er]

You don't need to write a review to mark a course as "played". So how would you get a million thumbs downs? As of right now, you look to be someone who's never played a course outside of SE Texas. Not that it really matters or anything, but filling out your course list would help your credibility, when talking about course comparisons.



And this^

Sorry but I don't care what my credibility is on the internetz!

Most who know me understand I am very interested in course design and I have worked with Dave Mac and helped Olse/Houck with a few ideas.

 

[Scoot_er]

Actually I just moved here for work - haven't got a chance to play too much, but I have played Knob Hill and Ashtabula. Wasn't impressed with either, especially with the high ratings Knob Hill gets. What else would you suggest playing near the Erie area? (I know, there's not much in Erie...it sucks)

The more I read the more I agree with this guy! Knob Hill was nice but has some pretty stupid holes that hurt the course and keep it from being pretty dang good. I also wasn't impressed when we drove from STL to Pittsburgh expecting awesome courses and getting decent/good courses. Morain was new at the time but also had some dumb holes that stuck out in my mind more than the good ones and overall hurt the course's rating in my mine.

 

[vslaugh]

I also wasn't impressed when we drove from STL to Pittsburgh expecting awesome courses and getting decent/good courses. Morain was new at the time but also had some dumb holes that stuck out in my mind more than the good ones and overall hurt the course's rating in my mine.

Not to distract from the argument in this thread, but can you remember enough to elaborate from a course design perspective why you didn't like certain holes, generally speaking (what makes those holes dumb in your mind)? My disc golf travels have been limited, but I'm really interested in what makes a good championship course and hope to see a couple more go in over the next few years.

Having moved to Pittsburgh a year ago, I'm a huge fan of Deer Lakes (Par 66 installed over the past couple years), but could never really get into Knob Hill like Deer Lakes. Moraine State Park falls somewhere in between but a little closer to Deer Lakes for me.

 

[PA Frolfer]

Also you blew your argument out of the water with this post! -10 for 24 holes is a fairly easy course.........especially when Liz is the person shooting the round. Not knocking her but the round was probably 1020 at the most (one of the best rounds by a woman) meaning a 1000 rated round is -7. To me it seems that flip lacks true par 4s which are needed in my opinion to rate a course a 4 and they need a few to be a 5.

Exactly what I said above - I don't understand how -10 is not easy. Oh well.

Not to distract from the argument in this thread, but can you remember enough to elaborate from a course design perspective why you didn't like certain holes, generally speaking (what makes those holes dumb in your mind)? My disc golf travels have been limited, but I'm really interested in what makes a good championship course and hope to see a couple more go in over the next few years.

As for Knob Hill, off the top of my head the two downhill holes in the middle of the course were repetitive. In addition, holes 2, 3, and 15 were a mess. Neither of these holes had any real gap and were just poke n hope holes. Hole 5 seemed to be a filler hole, and hole 6 had some potential but the basket was simply put behind a tree (when it could have been put any number of better places).

 

[optidiscic]

uh oh another flip review has gone up....at least PA Frolfer has emerged on the message boards unlike so many other suspect reviews....I tend to agree with PA FROLFER but I will still play Flip one day to see what the fuss is about.

 

[Terry C]

I know several guys on here who have played Flip and havent reviewed it yet. Once those slackers submit their reviews Flip will be back on top again.

 

[Jukeshoe]

I know several guys on here who have played Flip and havent reviewed it yet. Once those slackers submit their reviews Flip will be back on top again.

* cough cough* Valkyrie aka Nicholas Cage on the Downlow and *cough cough* mambrose. *cough*

Actually, I can see PA Frolfer's point on everything he has said except the actual rating of Flip. Ain't nohow's that that course is "average." Give it a 4 1/2, even a 4, but 3 discs is just criminal.

Even with the 3 discs, I defend PAF's right to express his opinion...at least he's backing it up and not just some fly-by hater.