DGPT: 2021 Ledgestone Insurance Open Aug 5-8

[nothinbuttree]

People have travel plans. Some have hotel or Air B&B accommodations for a set amount of time. Some have to be back at work on Monday. 3 rounds is plenty of disc golf to have a legit winner. You can't just say whoever wants to stay for another round can and if you can't stay sorry about your luck. The outcome was fair as all competitors played the same number of holes.

As much as this situation sucked, I think this best brings out as much fairness as possible to all involved. Good points.

I think a 'solution' is to start limiting high level events to fewer players, so we aren't teeing off the final round of a 4 round tourney at 3PM. Pools would help, but I heard there were 2000?? total competitors across all divisions for this event? Wow, no slack there for ANY problems...Expecting 4 full days with no weather delays in the middle of summer is asking a lot, IMHO. If there were fewer players, the round likely would have been over, or at least there would have been more slack time for it to clear out.

Then again, how often does this happen? I'm pretty new to watching events.

 

[the_lung]

I'm really surprised that's the case. Imagine it's worlds, Paul is up by one going into the final round, then Ricky leads by 5 strokes after 16 holes and they stop due to weather and Paul wins. That would be a laughingstock forever. They seriously need to look at that for next season and beyond.

It's fairly obvious that there are a lot of newbies here.

This isn't the PGA Tour. Everyone running the tournament needs to go back to their day jobs tomorrow. Literally dozens and dozens of staff and volunteers. The lightning, thunder, wind and rain that moved through there was absolutely insane and someone could have been killed in it. It's a no-brainer to cancel.

This has the way it has always been, and everyone who isn't new to the sport understands it. The policy has been revisited many times over the decades, and will not change.

 

[@CD-]

I'm really surprised that's the case. Imagine it's worlds, Paul is up by one going into the final round, then Ricky leads by 5 strokes after 16 holes and they stop due to weather and Paul wins. That would be a laughingstock forever. They seriously need to look at that for next season and beyond.

It would be official after 13 holes... I think

Minimum 13 holes to produce a rated round.
https://www.pdga.com/faq#t133n203556

If play is suspended the round scores will be determined by the most completed holes by the entire field. In the scenario McCready described, likely McBeth and Wysocki are both on one of the top cards and each would have finished 16 holes. If it was less than 13 holes, then the round wouldn't be official and revert to the leading scores from the prior round completion.

 

[McCready]

It's fairly obvious that there are a lot of newbies here.

This isn't the PGA Tour. Everyone running the tournament needs to go back to their day jobs tomorrow. Literally dozens and dozens of staff and volunteers. The lightning, thunder, wind and rain that moved through there was absolutely insane and someone could have been killed in it. It's a no-brainer to cancel.

This has the way it has always been, and everyone who isn't new to the sport understands it. The policy has been revisited many times over the decades, and will not change.

Yeah I'm a total noob. JFC, read what I posted. I never suggested they should play in a damn lightning storm.

"This is the way it's always been" isn't exactly the visionary mindset that will make the sport break through. Look at the crowds and TV coverage they were getting in Finland before Covid. And the crowds we're already getting here when there are no restrictions. And the ESPN deal. On this trajectory, live coverage of Worlds on an ESPN or Fox platform within a decade is not crazy to imagine. And think of what's at stake for the player who wins his first world title, or third or sixth. These are career milestones and major bumps in revenue. It's time to think bigger.

 

[Hampstead]

ESPN has been a dangling carrot for nearly 20 years. Anyone who has been playing awhile knows this. Disc golf is what it is. It will never become the money making juggernaut that is Professional Cornhole.

 

[teemkey]

ESPN has been a dangling carrot for nearly 20 years. Anyone who has been playing awhile knows this. Disc golf is what it is. It will never become the money making juggernaut that is Professional Cornhole.

It's OK as long as we stay ahead of Professional Hurling.

 

[Hampstead]

It's OK as long as we stay ahead of Professional Hurling.

The hierarchy of athletic relevance appears to be holding strong.




For now....

 

[teemkey]

The hierarchy of athletic relevance appears to be holding strong.




For now....

Yes, if you're using the Bevis & Butthead system of culturo-athletic gradation.

 

[teemkey]

What about those players that completed the fourth round (or 13 holes?)?

Did they fall into a theoretical PDGA black hole?

 

[Flick Maniac]

FWIW, the gold medal in mens high jump at the Tokyo Olympics right now was decided by a tie. Rules say if the top participants have the same results throughout the finals, if they both agree they can both take home the gold. If one says no, they go into a jump off. Can you imagine risking gold just because you dont want the other guy to have his share?

Ps. What does a split prize look like? They carve it up right down the middle? "Give me half the bear, Cale!"

 

[BogeyNoMore]

I posted the PDGA's rules for this situation.
You don't have to like them, but they clearly say it goes back to the last completed round, so Calvin and Ricky are co-champions.

Maybe they can work out a joint custody deal where Calvin keeps the trophy during even numbered years and Ricky keeps it for odd.

Those two just might have benefitted from it being shortened. Hard to say when KK was gonna get off that birdie train, while the lead card was kinda struggling.

 

[glassila]

There is a billion dollar sport that has rain shortened events 2 or 3 times per season...NASCAR.
Drivers, teams, sponsors and fans understand the rule.

I am not 100% sure if NASCAR is a billion dollar sport or not, but I am 100% sure it is bigger than disc golf.

 

[_MTL_]

When USDGC had a hurricane on tap for the finale on Saturday, USDGC staff originally posted that they were pushing the final round back to Sunday.

Dozens upon dozens of players let them know they had flights on sunday that couldnt be moved and they were DNFing.

They then shifted to canceling the event.

Moving things back a day isn't as simple as it seems.

 

[@CD-]

Minimum 13 holes to produce a rated round.
https://www.pdga.com/faq#t133n203556

If play is suspended the round scores will be determined by the most completed holes by the entire field. In the scenario McCready described, likely McBeth and Wysocki are both on one of the top cards and each would have finished 16 holes. If it was less than 13 holes, then the round wouldn't be official and revert to the leading scores from the prior round completion.

Correction based on the link to PDGA guidelines DGPT posted, the last round would be cut off at 9 (final 9 style) or 13 holes. Under 9 is when it gets dropped

Has finished at least 9 holes, but less than 13, the TD will use only the first 9 hole scores for the round
and disregard any further holes played.

Has finished 13 holes, but less than 18, the TD will use only the first 13 hole scores for the round and
disregard any further holes played.

https://www.pdga.com/files/pdga_mid-event_suspension_and_cancellation_guidelines_-_final.pdf

 

[VictorB]

What about those players that completed the fourth round (or 13 holes?)?

Did they fall into a theoretical PDGA black hole?

All players in a pool must complete the prescribed 13 holes for the round to count.

Any rounds that were completed were voided and essentially never happened.

 

[robdeforge]

I think a 'solution' is to start limiting high level events to fewer players, so we aren't teeing off the final round of a 4 round tourney at 3PM.

yup. earlier coverage had been highlighting how this was the biggest dg event ever in terms of number of participants. maybe round 4 needs a cut

 

[BillFleming]

Ledgestone Pro/AM (Masters and AMS) A tier = 1716 players. Ledgestone Pros Elite Tour = 206. That's a lot to get through in one day - even with different groups on different courses. I've wondered why the MPO and FPO don't start earlier in the day so they can get finished. One thought is that the Ams and/or Masters would be the better group to go last in case a round has to be cancelled. But then I realized why the MPO/FPO go later in the day.....it keeps the spectators there. If the MPO/FPO went early, pretty much everyone would leave after they were done....the TD would also have to decide if they give the trophies at the end of their rounds or make them wait until the end of the day. I doubt the MPO/FPO winners would want to wait around. One solution would be shotgun starts, with the lead card starting hole 1.

It didn't help that hole 15 (I think that was the one) had a 45 to hour long backup.

 

[krupicka]

On Sunday:
MPO started teeing off at 7:30am
FPO started teeing off at 7:00am
How much earlier should they start?
(fwiw we started MPO at 6:49am on Saturday)

 

[peabody]

Let's say it's round 4 and one of the top two gets disqualified from the tournament. (smoking dank/fistfight/throwing Calvins bag in the lake)
Not only disqualified but having a suspension pending board review.
Are they both still crowned winners after the storm?
I guess what I'm asking is can you be disqualified from a tournament and still be declared the winner?

 

[biscoe]

Let's say it's round 4 and one of the top two gets disqualified from the tournament. (smoking dank/fistfight/throwing Calvins bag in the lake)
Not only disqualified but having a suspension pending board review.
Are they both still crowned winners after the storm?
I guess what I'm asking is can you be disqualified from a tournament and still be declared the winner?

Many years ago there was a player in this area who had shot the best scores in an event and was dq'ed after the rounds were over. (There was a hole over part of a lake. Someone was in a boat fishing and got all dicky when asked to move. The player threw a stick in his vicinity which splashed him and the fisherman reported it to the park who reported it to the TD.)

Can you be dq'ed based on a round that "never happened" is a different question though. My opinion is yes- players are still subject to the rules of play during the round.