Uli's walking putt

[Kodachrome]

I don't believe I ever mentioned anything about arguing, complaining, or retaliation.

I said I'd take a provisional. I also mentioned my inner dialogue that would be occurring at the time. We would talk to the td and get the ruling one way or another, and there would be no issue.

Though prior to that I would do the walking putt again, and I would tell them to watch reeeeeally closely. If they called it again then we'd go the previously mentioned route.

 

[grodney]

Nope, helix was the term used early on for what we call a flex shot now. It's not used all that often anymore, but I still hear older golfers (especially here in southern California) call it that.

Absolutely. Helix shots were called helix long before they were called anything else.

 

[grodney]

From the archives:

From: Conrad Damon <[email protected]>
Subject: <DG> Disc Golf Definitions (Greg Barnicoat)
Date: 1996/02/06
Message-ID: <[email protected]>#1/1
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DISC GOLF DEFINITIONS



Leading Edge- The right or left edge of the disc, relative to the
direction of flight, spinning towards the direction of flight.

Trailing Edge- The edge of the disc spinning away from the direction
of flight.
Nose- The front part of the disc relative to the
direction being traveled.
Tail- The rear part of the disc relative
to the direction being traveled.
Angle- The number of degrees from
horizontal that either the leading or trailing edge is.
Hyzer- When
the leading edge lies below the trailing edge of the disc.
Anhyzer-
When the trailing edge lies below the leading edge of the disc.

Turnover- When a disc changes from a hyzer orientation to an anhyzer
orientation.
Helix- When a disc changes from an anhyzer orientation
to a hyzer orientation.
Double Helix- When a disc changes from a
hyzer orientation to an anhyzer orientation then back to a hyzer
orientation.
Nose-up/Tail-skate- When the nose of the disc is above
the tail.
Nose-down- When the nose of the disc is below the tail.

Stable- Maintains the same angle for a large portion of its flight.

Understable- Progresses towards a lesser degree of hyzer angle or a
greater degree of anhyzer angle during flight.
Overstable-
Progresses towards a greater degree of hyzer angle or a lesser degree
of anhyzer angle during flight.
Attitude- The amount (in degrees) of
nose-up or nose-down on the disc (nose-up is positive attitude,
nose-down is negative attitude).
Spin- The rate of rotation of the
disc.
Back hand- A throw where the back of the hand leads the disc
towards the line of flight prior to release.
Forehand/Sidearm- A
throw where the palm of the hand leads the disc towards the line of
flight prior to release.
Thumber- A forehand type shot where the
thumb instead of the fingers is beneath the flight plate and the disc
is typically thrown right-side-up.
Hand Grenade- A forehand type
shot where the thumb instead of the fingers is beneath the flight
plate and the disc is typically thrown from near vertical to
up-side-down.
Upside-down/Pan- A forehand throw where the disc is
thrown near vertical and is intended to fly upside-down.
Knife- A
back hand throw where the thumb is beneath the flight plate and the
disc is typically thrown from up-side
-down to near vertical.

Roller- A type of throw that is intended to roll on its trailing
edge.
Skip- A type of throw that is intended to hit the ground on a
hyzer angle and then skip or raise up again to fly further.
Air
Bounce- A type of throw where the initial inertia of the disc is not
totally in the same plane as the attitude and angle of the disc.

Route- The three dimensional path of a shot.

Shot- Throw.

 

[JC17393]

I don't believe I ever mentioned anything about arguing, complaining, or retaliation.

I said I'd take a provisional. I also mentioned my inner dialogue that would be occurring at the time. We would talk to the td and get the ruling one way or another, and there would be no issue.

Chances are that if you were called and seconded on a violation, the TD isn't going to side with you no matter what you argue. If it's just a warning (meaning only one player called it), the TD is likely going to rule in favor of the caller unless everyone but the caller emphatically agrees it wasn't a violation.

So unless the belief is the caller is making stuff up and trying to game the rules to get in your head or something to that effect, declaring and throwing a provisional for a stance violation is pretty much a waste of time.

 

[BrotherDave]

Oh, and I'll add that if you have learned this style of jump putt, you would know that if your foot contacts the ground before release, the disc will come out like a wounded duck, and be totally ineffective.

Yeah, I jump putt the traditional way and this holds true for me. If my left foot hits the ground before the disc leaves it kills any advantage the technique offers and arguably disadvantages me.

 

[kerplunk]

Chances are that if you were called and seconded on a violation, the TD isn't going to side with you no matter what you argue. If it's just a warning (meaning only one player called it), the TD is likely going to rule in favor of the caller unless everyone but the caller emphatically agrees it wasn't a violation.

So unless the belief is the caller is making stuff up and trying to game the rules to get in your head or something to that effect, declaring and throwing a provisional for a stance violation is pretty much a waste of time.

Unless the two players both misunderstood the rule, which could certainly happen with a walk-putt and a few other tough rules situations. If I was certain my walk-putt was legal but was called and seconded, I would probably take a provisional and ask the TD to ask both players whether they were certain that my front foot hit the ground before the disc was released.

 

[SpringDgLover]

Anyone who doesnt think this gives him an advantage is kidding themselves. By the time he releases his putt he is more than a yard closer to the basket.

 

[Aim For The Chains]

Lol.... That's a HUGE stride he takes then.

 

[SpringDgLover]

Lol.... That's a HUGE stride he takes then.

The average gate of a human is 3 feet = a yard and he is lunging.

 

[Ender175]

The average gate of a human is 3 feet = a yard and he is lunging.

Yeah but that's only a 1.5 foot advantage vs lunging from a squared stance.

 

[sidewinder22]

Is this beer pong rules, where you have to keep the elbow behind the edge of the table?

 

[Declarkus]

Once again:

You can break rules without gaining an advantage.

I don't get all the defenders of this suspect technique.

Also, anyone arguing there's a disadvantage when the foot hits before the disc is released needs to find me a video of a successful drive with the lead foot still in the air on release.

Jump putts are the only type of DG shot I can think of where the lead foot in the air could be considered an advantage, and even then, the advantage isn't what is argued in that technique; just the legality according to the rules.

 

[sidewinder22]

Once again:

I don't get all the defenders of this suspect technique.

Also, anyone arguing there's a disadvantage when the foot hits before the disc is released needs to find me a video of a successful drive with the lead foot still in the air on release.

Jump putts are the only type of DG shot I can think of where the lead foot in the air could be considered an advantage, and even then, the advantage isn't what is argued in that technique; just the legality according to the rules.

But it's the wrong foot to be throwing off or pivoting on. Try throwing or putting in an opposite stance with your left foot forward, it sure ain't easier. You would have to have your front/left foot well planted to generate anything from it which would be the most obvious foot fault ever.

 

[Chainsgoching]

I use this technique for jump putts at times, it's quite effective. I do my best to make sure I'm legal. Cheaters suck

 

[The Hammer]

Anyone who doesnt think this gives him an advantage is kidding themselves. By the time he releases his putt he is more than a yard closer to the basket.

He wouldn't do it if it didn't give him an advantage. Does that mean it should be illegal? Throwing 500' is an advantage over those that can't. Should we limit how far a person can throw to eliminate that advantage? I think not.

 

[geoblime]

I went home and tried this putting/approach style...I was banging 40 footers left and right! It's very easy to tell if your'e foot has hit the ground before release. Maybe not to other people watching but I'd guess my foot was 3-4" above ground at the time of release. I purposely tried to put my foot down and it messed up the putt. Almost like stopping your forward momentum of sorts.

This is a welcome addition coming from a straddle putter. This style seems to "project" the disc better. The crazy thing is I switched the lead foot (right handed, left foot forward) and I was just as accurate if not more. Problem was discs flew much faster than the normal lead foot style (right/right) thus leaving some wicked come backers. I'm a convert and highly suggest people try it before knocking it.

 

[Dan Ensor]

I tried it to, and see no reason to get that close.

 

[Countchunkula]

Uli's step putt looks like a clear foot fault in real time. When I first saw it, I was amazed that he would do something that appears so obviously illegal.

I've yet to see video evidence of a clear foot fault though. With as many times as he's used it, you would think someone would have found evidence by now. Seriously, if the "great minds" of DGCR can't find a frame showing a foot fault; we have to give him the benefit of the doubt (not that it matters, almost none of us would ever be on a card with him).

 

[Declarkus]

I couldn't find anything definitive in the 2014 Worlds coverage, but I did come across an illegal Uli jump putt. It happens at 22:21-22:22. I don't have a fancy slow mo program to break it down, but when I pause it at 22:21.5, he's in the air before release.



This is just an observation, so please don't make this out to be any more than that. This is not a personal attack on the guy's character or anything. It's just the reason I'm against these gimmicky putting techniques. If anything, it's an attack on the PDGA and their silly rules.

Whether he intends to violate the rules or gains an advantage is really beside the point. What kills me about this is if someone did call it, wouldn't he get another crack at trying to make it? So isn't that why it's not getting called? Because the rules aren't penalizing properly? 802.04 E&F are a joke.

 

[DeadEye]

That jump-approach isn't really what most people are talking about in this thread. Also, being in the air when you let go of the disc negates all advantages of a jump putt.

When called on a foot fault you get another shot the first time, the second time it's a penalty.

I am one of the few jump-putters in the small town I live in that is pretty accurate. I've done every style there is, jump, straddle-jump, step, everything.. I have gone to more of a step/jump now. It's not as close as Uli's is but it is still close, sometimes people will say something about it, but they'll never call it outright because there's nothing definitive to say that it is a foot fault.

Like McBeth says in his AMA on this exact subject. Whatever it takes to get the disc in the basket(granted within reason), worry about your own game.